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BD RB Beta released! - now at version 0.31.02 (November 17th, 2009)
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12. January 2009 @ 08:54 |
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Originally posted by Ryu77:
Originally posted by odin24:
@Ryu77, your TrueHD track for TDK will create an enourmous amount of m2ts overhead, more than regular AC3 or DTS creates for a DVD9... it may notbe worth it. Just giving you a heads up.
It's still 6% regardless...
8,152MB x 0.94 = 7,662MB usable media space (minus the 6% headers).
7,662MB - 2,324MB (TrueHD track) = 5,338MB left for video.
The movie is 2h 32min & 13sec. That leaves 4,898kbs available for video. Probably best to round it down to 4,850kbs. Hmmm... Probably not quite enough bitrate for the quality I like.
I can't find a way to multiplex TrueHD anyway. Sonic Scenarist wont accept it either. :-(
Either mux to m2ts using tsMuxeR, then reprocess through tsremux to Blu-ray. Or input your recoded video (must be m2ts) into tsremux, and the THD track directly from the BD rip into tsremux (with your encode). Either way you need to use tsremux to get your BD output for THD.
EDIT:
I think the 6-7% rule applies when we use an h264, AC3 or DTS stream for a DVD5 or 9... I mean when we agreed on the rule that's all we were encoding to.
Here is a comparison of raw audio from The Dark Knight. The first shows the TrueHD track, then muxed to M2TS alone. Notice the 1GB increase in size, ~33% of an increase. The second comparison is the same TrueHD track converted to PCM, then that PCM track in M2TS alone. Notice the increase in size is not nearly as much, around a 7% increase.
Also, this audio track has a bit depth of 16 bits... that's a huge PCM track!
TrueHD Comparison
PCM Comparison
Conclusion; I'm pretty sure the m2ts overhead depends on content and is not a fixed amount.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 12. January 2009 @ 10:42
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12. January 2009 @ 15:45 |
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Originally posted by Sophocles:
Quote:
Can you describe the picture quality you're getting with your encodes for us?
I've been doing this for quite some time before BD RB was released and the picture quality is excellent. Think of it like this. X/H.264 is about 3 to 5 times more efficient than standard mpeg 2 format so in theory if it only used as much space and bitrate as a standard DVD then it should be considerably better. The bitrate even in the recorded space of a DVD/5 is still more than twice that of a standard DVD. I've been successful in backing up most 2 hour movies to a single layer DVD with 1080P, no artifacts, and no visual grain or mosquito effect.
For a Beta this is a very good & easy program to use.I backed up Babylon A.D. & really impressed with the results for this to be a beta.But im still going to try this program out with a very good PQ Blu-Ray because Babylon A.D. Blu-Ray didn't have the Best PQ.Also Sophocles do you know if there going to be audio upgrades to BD-RD like AC-3 640 over AC-3 448 ? Thxs.
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12. January 2009 @ 15:50 |
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odin24, Fair enough...
Which application did you use for the muxing? As we know TrueHD muxing with tsMuxeR is questionable, and may not provide accurate testing in regards to size and overheads.
I haven't really done much with TrueHD up until now. I was already aware of using tsRemux for TrueHD. However, with The Dark Knight it does not seem to work. Are you saying that method with tsRemux worked with The Dark Knight for you?
Because, it will not work for me. There are folks over at Doom9 having the same problem.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 12. January 2009 @ 15:53
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12. January 2009 @ 16:18 |
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Originally posted by Ryu77:
odin24, Fair enough...
Which application did you use for the muxing? As we know TrueHD muxing with tsMuxeR is questionable, and may not provide accurate testing in regards to size and overheads.
I haven't really done much with TrueHD up until now. I was already aware of using tsRemux for TrueHD. However, with The Dark Knight it does not seem to work. Are you saying that method with tsRemux worked with The Dark Knight for you?
Because, it will not work for me. There are folks over at Doom9 having the same problem.
I used tsMuxeR, but tried tsremux for a better apples-to-apples comparison. We're thinking on the same wavelength... I tried remuxing using the BD m2ts (totally bypassing tsMuxeR), tsremux would not finish the remux, however my best attempt made it to about 75%, the m2ts file size at that point was 1.8GB
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 12. January 2009 @ 16:21
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12. January 2009 @ 17:51 |
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Quote:
Also Sophocles do you know if there going to be audio upgrades to BD-RD like AC-3 640 over AC-3 448 ? Thxs.
Sorry for a late reply but my real job kept me busy, and out work connection is filters AD's forum out. I can almost guarantee HD and AC-3 640 since the latter is my preferred audio bitrate, although in a pinch I can take 448.
Ryu
I've been reading your attempt at backing up a 2:32 movie with HD audio. I would be interested in hearing about the outcome. You could always mount and play it back from your hard drive.
"And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."
Friedrich Nietzsche
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Senior Member
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13. January 2009 @ 02:39 |
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Originally posted by Sophocles:
Ryu
I've been reading your attempt at backing up a 2:32 movie with HD audio. I would be interested in hearing about the outcome. You could always mount and play it back from your hard drive.
I have also been busy so I haven't had much time to dedicate towards this but I have been unsuccessful so far. Sonic Scenarist (commercial BD authoring software) rejected the TrueHD track also.
In regards to playing from my hard drive, my PC is connected directly to my Home Theater as it is designed for complete Media Center functionality. ArcSoft TotalMedia Theatre (media player) allows you to navigate to the Blu-ray folders on your hard drive and play it as if it were a disc. I would also like to note that this media player seems to be the only one tested to decode HD audio 100% correctly.
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13. January 2009 @ 07:11 |
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Originally posted by Ryu77:
Originally posted by Sophocles:
Ryu
I've been reading your attempt at backing up a 2:32 movie with HD audio. I would be interested in hearing about the outcome. You could always mount and play it back from your hard drive.
I have also been busy so I haven't had much time to dedicate towards this but I have been unsuccessful so far. Sonic Scenarist (commercial BD authoring software) rejected the TrueHD track also.
In regards to playing from my hard drive, my PC is connected directly to my Home Theater as it is designed for complete Media Center functionality. ArcSoft TotalMedia Theatre (media player) allows you to navigate to the Blu-ray folders on your hard drive and play it as if it were a disc. I would also like to note that this media player seems to be the only one tested to decode HD audio 100% correctly.
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david89
Account closed as per user's own request
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15. January 2009 @ 16:11 |
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so when you re-encode to dvd-5 size does it do it in 720p 1280x720 or is it 1080p i think if it did 720p might be better because have more bitrate for video depending on how long your movie or whatever is if not that would be great option for the furture like a selecter for 1080p or 720p?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2009 @ 16:12
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15. January 2009 @ 17:51 |
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david89
The best thing to do is experiment, get a feel for it, and then decide what's best for you.
"And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."
Friedrich Nietzsche
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16. January 2009 @ 03:47 |
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Painful but worth it.
Just completed Apocalypto last night.
Encoded from mounted ISO on HDD to DVD-9 (movie only)
11 Hours 46 Mins in total.
The quality again though is what I was hoping for, and was worth the wait.
Loaded it up on another OS (XP Pro) same as on Vista, but keep getting source not in BD format, not sure if its a setup or program issue, as said I loaded it in the same order and with the same settings. Maybe I've just found something that prefers Vista of XP for a change.
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16. January 2009 @ 08:09 |
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Originally posted by BigDK:
Loaded it up on another OS (XP Pro) same as on Vista, but keep getting source not in BD format, not sure if its a setup or program issue, as said I loaded it in the same order and with the same settings. Maybe I've just found something that prefers Vista of XP for a change.
Install Toshiba's UDF2.5 driver on your XP machine, maybe that'll help.
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16. January 2009 @ 11:46 |
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Will give that a try later.
Thanks for the info.
Will post the update when I see what the result is.
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16. January 2009 @ 13:34 |
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Reencoding Apocalypto again, now at 12%
Just realised that I selected english language (which only gave directors comments audio)
Should have selected mayan language :)
Never mind, must pay more attention to what it is I'm working on in future.
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16. January 2009 @ 14:47 |
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Originally posted by BigDK:
Reencoding Apocalypto again, now at 12%
Just realised that I selected english language (which only gave directors comments audio)
Should have selected mayan language :)
Never mind, must pay more attention to what it is I'm working on in future.
You should not need to reencode, just demux/convert the Mayan track, remux with your initial encode... unless the Mayan track will put your disc size just over the limit.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. January 2009 @ 14:48
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16. January 2009 @ 16:10 |
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I don’t have a clue how to do that.
I’m now at 50% reencoding, so will at least get over the issue if I let it run a few more hours, but would still like to learn how to do what you’ve suggested.
Looks like I need to learn some more tricks to take my encoding abilities to the new level.
Any pointers you can give on what tools I need to be using would be appreciated, and should speed up the learning curve.
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16. January 2009 @ 16:36 |
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First of all, what is the source? BD rip, mkv, m2ts? Did you remember to include subtitles? For demuxing subs and or audio I strongly suggest eac3to... command line approach. We'll use tsMuxeR to remux your original encode plus the new Mayan audio along with the subtitles.
Once that is done you might need to patch the CLPI file (very easy to do) plus we'll make this very sweet by automatically enabling subtitles, you'll need BDEdit for that... D/L it here.
All of this is very easy to do... but first I need to know what form the source is in to help.
BTW, what is your BD player?
@ Sophocles, is there an option in BD-RB to automatically enable subtitles?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. January 2009 @ 16:38
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16. January 2009 @ 18:00 |
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@ Sophocles, is there an option in BD-RB to automatically enable subtitles?
If we're discussing user selectable subtitles for different languages then no since they are a menu selectable item, but if they're subtitles that are an actual part of the original stream then they should be encoded with the movie.
I think jdobbs is working on allowing one to keep the menu to allow sound track and subtitle selection without all the extras but that will be a while.
If I've misunderstood the question then ignore this. LOL
"And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."
Friedrich Nietzsche
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16. January 2009 @ 18:44 |
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No... you're sorta on track. In BigDK's case, he's working on Apocalypto, he want's the Mayan audio track, so he'll need the English subtitle track, which is not coded into the video stream.
I know it is possible to enable a muxed subtitles stream to automatically play using BDEdit, I was just wondering if this is possible in BD-RB, I just had a look myself... I don't think it is possible.... yet.
EDIT: A menu is not needed to keep user selectable subs, these can be activated/deactivated using the remote's subtitle button, or the PS3's onscreen menu.
I have processed maybe two (of the many) BDs that had forced subs that were not hardcoded. Obviously the ability to retain subs is a must, this being for foreign movies, and the ability to enable the subtitle stream automaticlly would be nice too.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. January 2009 @ 18:52
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16. January 2009 @ 18:57 |
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Quote:
No... you're sorta on track. In BigDK's case, he's working on Apocalypto, he want's the Mayan audio track, so he'll need the English subtitle track,
Not in a movie only re-encode for now because you will still need the option to select or de-select subtitles and that requires a menu.
"And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."
Friedrich Nietzsche
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16. January 2009 @ 19:06 |
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Originally posted by Sophocles:
Quote:
No... you're sorta on track. In BigDK's case, he's working on Apocalypto, he want's the Mayan audio track, so he'll need the English subtitle track,
Not in a movie only re-encode for now because you will still need the option to select or de-select subtitles and that requires a menu.
You do not need a menu to have subs, I have tested this on the PS3 and Sony BDP350. Just mux your 3 streams, to enable/disable subs just use the subtitle button on the remote. To have the subtitles on immediately it is just a matter of editing the "movieobject.bdmv" file in the BD structure, really it only take about a minute.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. January 2009 @ 19:07
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16. January 2009 @ 19:11 |
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odin
Since I never keep subs, could you explain to BigDk how to do it with RB? There are probably others who are going to ask the same question.
"And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."
Friedrich Nietzsche
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16. January 2009 @ 19:48 |
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Originally posted by Sophocles:
odin
Since I never keep subs, could you explain to BigDk how to do it with RB? There are probably others who are going to ask the same question.
Sorry, I originally asked if subs can be enabled automatically assuming that BD-RB had subtitle support.
Without actually going through the whole encode it looks like you can keep as many subtitle streams as you'd like. In the Stream tab, expand the subtitle tree, make sure there is a "a beside the stream of choice, double clicking the stream can change it's status, all other streams should be "X'd" out... basically the same process as choosing audio.
Having your subtitles automatically play, this is done once BD-RB is done it's thing. Use BDedit (link) for this.
1. Open BDedit
2. Browse for your BD structure, open the BDMV folder
3. Hit the "Read" button
4. Highlight the "0001" line on the right hand side.
5. Hit the "+" to the right of that
6. Highlight the new line
7. Input the following shown below, do not input the "Hex" values, they will update once the other settings are made. Once complete hit the "Save" button.
Doing this will enable subtitles automatically so you do not need to turn them on upon initial playback.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. January 2009 @ 19:52
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16. January 2009 @ 22:03 |
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Odin
Thanks. It should be helpful to those that are interested in keeping subtitles.
One small thing. Your version of RB is slightly dated. The latest verson is 17.13.
"And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."
Friedrich Nietzsche
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16. January 2009 @ 22:39 |
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Originally posted by Sophocles:
Odin
Thanks. It should be helpful to those that are interested in keeping subtitles.
One small thing. Your version of RB is slightly dated. The latest verson is 17.13.
Thanks... Updated. Honestly though, I haven't used BD-RB yet, the next title I feel is worthy of archiving I will though.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. January 2009 @ 22:44
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17. January 2009 @ 02:22 |
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odin24, excellent job on the little guide for forcing subtitles. :-)
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