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The Players, The Recorders, The Discs and The Films

Discussion in 'Blu-ray players' started by Nicklt, Jan 23, 2006.

  1. Nicklt

    Nicklt Regular member

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    Blu-Ray Players:

    http://www.blu-ray.com/images/players/samsung.jpg - Samsung BD-P1000

    http://www.blu-ray.com/images/players/lg.jpg - LG BD199

    http://www.blu-ray.com/images/players/sharp.jpg - Sharp DV BP1U

    I think the Sharp one looks the best.

    Blu-Ray Revorders:

    http://www.blu-ray.com/images/recorders/sharp.jpg - Sharp BD-HD100

    http://www.blu-ray.com/images/recorders/mitsubishi.jpg - Mitsubishi (Prototype) The 70s FTW

    http://www.blu-ray.com/images/recorders/philips.jpg - Philips IPS01

    Blu-Ray Films Releases:

    Aeon Flux (Paramount)
    The Amityville Horror (MGM) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Angel Seekers (Air TBS) - Japan only
    Armageddon (Disney)
    Basic Instinct (Lions Gate) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Batman Begins (Warner)
    Behind Enemy Lines (Fox)
    Black Hawk Down (Sony)
    Bram Stoker's Dracula (Sony)
    The Bridge on the River Kwai (Sony)
    The Brothers Grimm (Disney)
    Charlie and the Chocolate Factory (Warner)
    Chicken Little (Disney) - Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    Constantine (Warner)
    Crimson Tide (Disney) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Dark Water (Disney)
    Desperado (Sony)
    The Devil's Rejects (Lions Gate)
    Dinosaur (Disney)
    The Dukes of Hazzard (Warner)
    Dune (Lions Gate) - TV series
    Everest (Disney) - Documentary
    Fantastic Four (Fox)
    The Fifth Element (Sony)
    Flightplan (Disney) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    For a Few Dollars More (MGM)
    Four Brothers (Paramount)
    Goodfellas (Warner) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    The Great Raid (Disney)
    The Guns of Navarone (Sony)
    Hero (Disney)
    Hitch (Sony)
    House of Flying Daggers (Sony)
    Ice Age (Fox)
    The Incredibles (Disney) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Into The Blue (Sony) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    The Italian Job (Paramount)
    Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back (Disney)
    Kill Bill Vol. 1 (Disney)
    King Arthur (Disney) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Kiss of the Dragon (Fox)
    A Knight's Tale (Sony)
    Kung Fu Hustle (Sony)
    Ladder 49 (Disney)
    The Last Samurai (Warner)
    The Last Waltz (MGM) - Documentary
    The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen (Fox)
    Legends of the Fall (Sony)
    Lethal Weapon (Warner)
    Lord of War (Lions Gate)
    The Manchurian Candidate (Paramount)
    The Matrix (Warner)
    The Matrix Reloaded (Warner) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Million Dollar Baby (Warner)
    Mission Impossible (Paramount) - Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    Mission Impossible 2 (Paramount) - Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    Mission Impossible 3 (Paramount) - Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    New Cinema Paradise (Asmik Ace) - Japan only
    Ocean's Twelve (Warner)
    Pirates of the Caribbean (Disney) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    The Punisher (Lions Gate)
    Rambo: First Blood (Lions Gate)
    Reservoir Dogs (Lions Gate)
    Resident Evil (Sony) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Resident Evil: Apocalypse (Sony)
    Robocop (MGM)
    S.W.A.T (Sony)
    Sahara (Paramount)
    Saw (Lions Gate)
    See No Evil (Lions Gate)
    Sense and Sensibility (Sony)
    Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow (Paramount)
    Sleepy Hollow (Paramount)
    Species (MGM)
    Spider-Man (Sony) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES
    Stargate Atlantis (MGM) - TV series
    Stealth (Sony)
    Steamboy (Bandai Visual) - Japan only
    Step Into Liquid (Lions Gate)
    Swordfish (Warner)
    Terminator 2: Judgment Day (Lions Gate)
    Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines (Warner)
    Tomb Raider (Paramount)
    Total Recall (Lions Gate)
    Training Day (Warner)
    Troy (Warner)
    Twister (Warner)
    U2: Rattle and Hum (Paramount) - Documentary
    Underworld: Evolution (Sony) - Not a launch title, to be released later in 2006
    Unforgiven (Warner)
    We Were Soldiers (Paramount)
    xXx (Sony)
    xXx: State of the Union (Sony) - Not yet announced, but packaging shown at CES

    http://www.blu-ray.com/images/media/sony2.jpg - Disc (Prototype)

    FAQ:


    What is Blu-ray?


    Blu-ray, also known as Blu-ray Disc (BD) is the name of a next-generation optical disc format. The format was developed to enable recording, rewriting and playback of high-definition video (HD). The format is also likely to become a standard for PC data storage and high-definition movies in the future.


    Why the name Blu-ray?


    The name Blu-ray is derived from the underlying technology, which utilizes a blue-violet laser to read and write data. The name is a combination of "Blue" (blue-violet laser) and "Ray" (optical ray). According to the Blu-ray Disc Association the spelling of "Blu-ray" is not a mistake, the character "e" was intentionally left out so the term could be registered as a trademark.

    The correct full name is Blu-ray Disc, not Blu-ray Disk (incorrect spelling)
    The correct shortened name is Blu-ray, not Blu-Ray (incorrect capitalization) or Blue-ray (incorrect spelling)
    The correct abbreviation is BD, not BR or BRD (wrong abbreviation)



    Who developed Blu-ray?


    The Blu-ray Disc format was developed by the Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA), a group of leading consumer electronics, personal computer and media manufacturers, with more than 170 member companies from all over the world. The Board of Directors currently consists of:

    Apple Computer, Inc.
    Dell Inc.
    Hewlett Packard Company
    Hitachi, Ltd.
    LG Electronics Inc.
    Matsushita Electric Industrial Co., Ltd.
    Mitsubishi Electric Corporation
    Pioneer Corporation
    Royal Philips Electronics
    Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
    Sharp Corporation
    Sony Corporation
    TDK Corporation
    Thomson Multimedia
    Twentieth Century Fox
    Walt Disney Pictures
    Warner Bros. Entertainment



    What Blu-ray formats are planned?


    As with conventional CDs and DVDs, Blu-ray plans to provide a wide range of formats including ROM/R/RW. The following formats are part of the Blu-ray Disc specification:

    BD-ROM - read-only format for software, games and movie distribution.
    BD-R - recordable format for video recording and PC data storage.
    BD-RE - rewritable format for video recording and PC data storage.



    How much data can you fit on a Blu-ray disc?


    A single-layer disc can fit 23.3GB, 25GB or 27GB.
    A dual-layer disc can fit 46.6GB, 50GB or 54GB.

    To ensure that the Blu-ray Disc format is easily extendable (future-proof) it also includes support for multi-layer discs, which should allow the storage capacity to be increased to 100GB-200GB (25GB per layer) in the future simply by adding more layers to the discs.


    How much video can you record on a Blu-ray disc?


    Over 2 hours of high-definition television (HDTV) on a 25GB disc.
    About 13 hours of standard-definition television (SDTV) on a 25GB disc.



    How fast can you read/write data on a Blu-ray disc?


    According to the Blu-ray Disc specification, 1x speed is defined as 36Mbps. However, as BD-ROM movies will require a 54Mbps data transfer rate the minimum speed we're expecting to see is 2x (72Mbps). Blu-ray also has the potential for much higher speeds, as a result of the larger numerical aperture (NA) adopted by Blu-ray Disc. The large NA value effectively means that Blu-ray will require less recording power and lower disc rotation speed than DVD and HD-DVD to achieve the same data transfer rate. While the media itself limited the recording speed in the past, the only limiting factor for Blu-ray is the capacity of the hardware. If we assume a maximum disc rotation speed of 10,000 RPM, then 12x at the outer diameter should be possible (about 400Mbps). This is why the Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA) already has plans to raise the speed to 8x (288Mbps) or more in the future.


    What video codecs will Blu-ray support?


    The Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA) is still in the process of finalizing the BD-ROM specification, but they have stated that MPEG-4 AVC High Profile (previously called FRExt) and Microsoft's VC-1 video codec (the proposed SMPTE standard based on WMV9) will be mandatory. They will also include MPEG-2 support for playback of HDTV recordings and DVDs. Please note that this simply means that all Blu-ray players and recorders will have to support playback of these video codecs, it will still be up to the movie studios to decide which video codec(s) they use for their releases. The BDA expects the BD-ROM specification to be finished some time in 2005.


    What audio codecs will Blu-ray support?


    The Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA) still hasn't made a final decision about what audio codecs will be included in the BD-ROM specification, but according to the BDF technical spokesman Richard Doherty, the included audio codecs should offer a significant improvement over the audio formats supported by the current DVD spec. They are currently looking into advanced audio codecs, including lossless codecs.


    Will Blu-ray discs require a cartridge?


    No, the development of new low cost hard-coating technologies has made the cartridge obsolete. Blu-ray will instead rely on hard-coating for protection, which when applied will make the discs even more resistant to scratches and fingerprints than todays DVDs, while still preserving the same look and feel. The adoption of hard-coating will also allow manufacturers to downsize players/drives and lower their overall media production costs.


    Will Blu-ray require an Internet connection?


    No, you will not need an Internet connection for playback of Blu-ray movies. The Internet connection will be used for value-added features such as downloading subtitles, movie trailers, web browsing, etc. It will also be required to authorize managed copies of Blu-ray movies that can be transferred over a home network.


    When will I be able to buy Blu-ray Disc products?


    The only place where you can currently buy Blu-ray Disc products is in Japan, where they already sell Blu-ray Disc recorders for recording HDTV. If you live in the US then you will most likely have to wait until the Blu-ray launch sometime in early 2006. While we've heard very little about the launch plans for the European market, we expect it to follow shortly after the US (a few products might launch earlier). We expect more details about the Blu-ray launch and upcoming products at CES in January 5-8, 2006.


    What will Blu-ray Disc products cost?


    As with any new technology the first generation of products will likely be quite expensive due to low production volumes. However, this shouldn't be a problem for long as there is a wide range of Blu-ray Disc products (players, recorders, drives, writers, media, etc) planned, which should help drive up production volumes and lower overall production costs. Once mass production of components for Blu-ray products begins the prices are expected to fall quickly.

    According to the Blu-ray Disc Association, the overall cost of manufacturing Blu-ray Disc media will in the end be no more expensive than producing a DVD. The reduced injection molding costs (one molding machine instead of two, no birefringence problems) offset the additional cost of applying the cover layer and low cost hard-coat, while the techniques used for applying the recording layer remain the same. As production volumes increase the production costs should fall and eventually be comparable to DVDs.


    Current technology

    Will Blu-ray replace VHS?


    Yes, that's the expectation. The Blu-ray Disc recorder represents a major leap forward in video recording technology as it enables recording of high-definition television (HDTV). It also offers a lot of new innovative features not possible with a traditional VCR:



    Random access, instantly jump to any spot on the disc

    Searching, quickly browse and preview recorded programs in real-time

    Create playlists, change the order of recorded programs and edit recorded video

    Automatically find an empty space to avoid recording over programs

    Simultaneous recording and playback of video (enables Time slip/Chasing playback)

    Enhanced interactivity, enables more advanced applications and games

    Broadband enabled, access online content, download subtitles and extras

    Improved picture, ability to record high-definition television (HDTV)

    Improved sound, ability to record surround sound (Dolby Digital, DTS, etc)


    Will Blu-ray replace DVD?


    It's still too early to say. In the end it's up to the movie studios to decide in what format they release their movies, so they will play a big part in the decision of which format becomes the standard for high-definition movies and the successor to DVD. The two formats will most likely co-exist for quite some time until high-definition takes over and becomes the norm.


    What's the difference between Blu-ray and DVD?


    Parameters
    BD-ROM DVD-ROM
    Storage capacity (single-layer) 25GB 4.7GB
    Storage capacity (dual-layer) 50GB 9.4GB
    Laser wavelength 405nm 650nm
    Numerical aperture (NA) 0.85 0.60
    Protection layer 0.1mm 0.6mm
    Data transfer rate (1x)
    Data transfer rate (movie application)
    36.0Mbps
    54.0Mbps (1.5x)
    11.08Mbps
    10.08Mbps

    Video compression MPEG-2
    MPEG-4 AVC
    VC-1
    MPEG-2



    Will Blu-ray be backwards compatible with DVD?


    Yes, several leading consumer electronics companies (including Panasonic, Philips, Pioneer, Samsung, Sharp, Sony and LG) have already demonstrated products that can read/write CDs, DVDs and Blu-ray discs using a BD/DVD/CD compatible optical head, so you don't have to worry about your existing DVD collection becoming obsolete. Although it's up to each manufacturer to decide if they want to make their products backwards compatible with DVD, the format is far too popular to not be supported. The Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA) expects every Blu-ray Disc device to be backward compatible with CDs and DVDs.


    What about Blu-ray for PCs?


    There are plans for BD-ROM (read-only), BD-R (recordable) and BD-RE (rewritable) drives for PCs, and with the support of the worlds two largest PC manufacturers, HP and Dell, it's very likely that the technology will be adopted as the next-generation optical disc format for PC data storage and replace technologies such as DVD±R, DVD±RW, and DVD-RAM.



    Next-generation technology

    Is Blu-ray the same thing as HD-DVD?


    No, HD-DVD (previously known as AOD) is the name of a competing next-generation optical disc format developed by Toshiba and NEC. The format is quite different from Blu-ray, but also relies heavily on blue-laser technology to achieve a higher storage capacity. The format is being developed within the DVD Forum as a possible successor to the current DVD technology.


    What's the difference between Blu-ray and HD-DVD?


    Parameters
    BD-ROM HD-DVD-ROM
    Storage capacity (single-layer) 25GB 15GB
    Storage capacity (dual-layer) 50GB 30GB
    Laser wavelength 405nm 405nm
    Numerical aperture (NA) 0.85 0.65
    Protection layer 0.1mm 0.6mm
    Data transfer rate (1x)
    Data transfer rate (movie application)
    36.0Mbps
    54.0Mbps (1.5x)
    36.55Mbps
    36.55Mbps

    Video compression MPEG-2
    MPEG-4 AVC
    VC-1
    MPEG-2
    MPEG-4 AVC
    VC-1



    Parameters
    BD-R HD-DVD-R
    Storage capacity (single-layer) 25GB 15GB
    Storage capacity (dual-layer) 50GB 30GB
    Laser wavelength 405nm 405nm
    Numerical aperture (NA) 0.85 0.65
    Protection layer 0.1mm 0.6mm
    Data transfer rate (1x)
    36.0Mbps
    36.55Mbps

    Video compression MPEG-2
    MPEG-4 AVC
    VC-1
    MPEG-2
    MPEG-4 AVC
    VC-1



    Parameters
    BD-RE HD-DVD-RW
    Storage capacity (single-layer) 25GB 15GB
    Storage capacity (dual-layer) 50GB 30GB
    Laser wavelength 405nm 405nm
    Numerical aperture (NA) 0.85 0.65
    Protection layer 0.1mm 0.6mm
    Data transfer rate (1x)
    36.0Mbps
    36.55Mbps

    Video compression MPEG-2
    MPEG-4 AVC
    VC-1
    MPEG-2
    MPEG-4 AVC
    VC-1

     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2006
  2. diabolos

    diabolos Guest

    @ Nicklt,
    Excellent posting, and even better reasearch! This thread should be a sticky.

    Ced
     
  3. Nicklt

    Nicklt Regular member

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    Thanks im a big fan of the new Blu-Ray technology
     
  4. arcanix

    arcanix Active member

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    I think it looks over-futuristic, too exaggareted. On the other hand the other players are too conservative. So I would go with sharp if I had to.
     
  5. diabolos

    diabolos Guest

    I think the LG playerr would look the best in high end setups that typically look conservitive. I like the Philips and the Sharp designs. The Samsung looks to much like there low end HTiBs. The Mitsubishi recorder looks like a moster, a real fashion don't!

    Ced
     
  6. JXP2307

    JXP2307 Regular member

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    I nominate for a sticky. Good research.
     
  7. diabolos

    diabolos Guest

    I 2nd that!

    Well Done!
     
  8. Glitched

    Glitched Guest

    yup this is great
     
  9. darthnip

    darthnip Moderator Staff Member

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    stickied
     
  10. DaveERG

    DaveERG Regular member

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    I Cant believe there re-releasing the same movies again. jeese first its vhs version, then dvd normal edition, then 2 disc edition, than platinum series and now bluray and hd dvd, screw these formats
     
  11. tpol069

    tpol069 Guest

    MPEG-4 AVC High Profile


    Hy, could anyone tell me if the above, is the same as the Nero Digital AVC codec? Would be great if it is, because for me nero digital and recode are the easiest way to convert any file.
     
  12. diabolos

    diabolos Guest

    They are both based on the MPEG-4 standards but they are a little different. I don't think Blu-Ray or HD-DVD players will play Nero MPEG-4 files but I could be wrong.

    Ced
     
  13. cygnus_76

    cygnus_76 Member

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    Is there any word if either of these formats is supposed to be any more difficult to back up?
     
  14. max777

    max777 Member

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    I'm not thrilled about buying the same movies over again in a format that's only slightly better resolution, and still prone to cracking and scratching. The sound quality won't be any different. And, when they say 2 hours of HDTV fits on 25GB, I hope that's not using the same bad compression quality we see on a lot of DVD's.

    For now I'm happy with my Toshiba SD-3990 I paid $50 and plays everything, even DIVX and stuff I rip off my computer. If I upgrade, it will be a media player, not just some console that only plays DVD.
     
  15. diabolos

    diabolos Guest

    The resolution improvement isn't slight. Going from 680x480i lines to 1920x1080p lines is a major step.

    Cracking and scraching? Blu-Ray discs are rumord to be more durable than DVDs. HD-DVDs are just as durable as DVDs.

    The sound quality will destoy the old AC3 Dolby Digital compression used in dvds today. Both of the new players support up to 8 Channels of uncompressed LPCM audio, (a format used with Concert DVDs but only with 2 Channels) DTS-HD, and Doby True HD (the 2 Channel version) which are both [bold]Lossless[/bold] surround sound compression formats.

    2 hours of HD? Maybe using MPEG-2 (A.K.A. the "bad compression quality we see on a lot of DVD's") at high bitates but Blu-Ray and HD-DVD also use MPEG-4 AVC and WMV-HD (VC-1) which are more than twice as efficient than MPEG-2.

    Ced
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 22, 2006
  16. diabolos

    diabolos Guest

    My Best Buy store (in Cincinnati, OHIO) just got our first 3 Toshiba HD-A1 HD-DVD players today. We also got HD-DVD movies but only two of them, 8 copies total (4 each). The movies are The Last Samuria and Phantom of the Opera.

    There were no HD-DVD samplers to try out so I can't comment on the HD-DVDs picture quality but I can say its a damn fine DVD upconvertor!

    Movies we have and will have soon...
    http://www.bestbuy.com/site//olspage.jsp?id=pcmcat87100050018&type=category

    Ced

     
  17. Zero4

    Zero4 Member

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    I do not understand the hype of HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. It is just a way to suck more money out of us. I am a huge Movie fan...Collevt them all....but dang....I have over 500 DVD's...and saw at Best buy HD-DVD....and well...it wasn't all that great. Why all that room on the new disc format? 25g's for a 2 hour movie? ARrrr? I hope this doesn't take off....I hope this mirrors the beta era...and dies off. Quickly
     
  18. Dfeyeant1

    Dfeyeant1 Member

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    You sad sad man. You suck and here's why: One or both of these formats is imminent. Sure, corporations stand to make a buck, but look what's in it for us. We get an improved viewing experience or more importantly for a movie maker like yourself, you can share your work on an even larger/higher-res canvas than was ever before possible. If that doesn't make your mouth water then I don't know how you even pretend to call yourself a Movie fan. A newer format is always imminent. Don't live in the past -be excited about the future. Pathetic excuse for a web page, Jim. I hope your kind mirror the jurrassic age.
     
  19. USERMJ911

    USERMJ911 Member

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    The movies are mad expensive, but you should see the quality on an HD, 1080p TV ( i saw
     
  20. rdxtreme

    rdxtreme Regular member

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    I hate all the designs!!!!! sure the sharp one is damn sexy but there are NO DISPLAYS on them. Who overlooked that!? with all the generations of media players out there manufacturers should by INSTINCT be able to please the consumer with displays. Time, chapter, options INFORMATION. Its necessary and proper.
     

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