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Theory on Swap-Disc free bios..

Discussion in 'Nintendo Gamecube - General discussion' started by indienemo, Mar 21, 2005.

  1. indienemo

    indienemo Guest

    When you try the 'Explore DVD' function in Cobra and you explore the original DVD, you can see that it has several .dol files on the DVD.... what I was thinking was that could we either extract these .dol files (They must contain the self boot code, right?)... and either use MakeVGC to make it into a GC bios, or burn it onto a backup disc along with a .iso /.gcm file, so that you wont need to swap discs?

    I hope someone in the know reads this, Nemo out.
     
  2. Artlover

    Artlover Member

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    Has nothing to do with why you need to swap a disc. The primary protection is the non reproducable BCA barcode on the disc. This is read by the dvd drive, not the gamecube. The disc swap has to do with allowing the drive to see a BCA barcode, initialize and hand control over to the gamecube till anything happens that triggers a drive reset.

    There will not be a swapless method of playing backups until a modchip comes out that ties into the dvd drive circuitry for manualy injecting a spoofed bca signal into it's electronics.
     
  3. Quezacotl

    Quezacotl Regular member

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    I had an idea too, if cut original game's gamepart off and leave barcode so disc has only center left, then put that cutted original in the drive and burned on it so that is the same as burned game has barcode.
     
  4. Ize

    Ize Regular member

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    Why not have a .dol file that reads the the BCA File and stores the info , It must be doable because you have to read the original disk, then it stops, then asks for the backup.. instead of losing that info, why not store it to the memory card and have a routine just look for the bootup info on the card, if no file is found, then make one.
     
  5. L-Burna

    L-Burna Active member

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    Why not make one disc that is pressed and direct boots,which could be a boot disc.Then you wouldn't have to worry about placing a barcode on the discs.You could turn your cube on with the disc in,when the screen appears it will stop the drive.Then you could open up the top cover,swap the discs then press the A button to start the drive again which could read the game.I think this would be alot easier to make,just an oppinion on my part.
     
  6. Ize

    Ize Regular member

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    Honestly, swaping a disk, really isn't a big problem for me.. i can't say the same for other...
     
  7. Artlover

    Artlover Member

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    Again, it doesn't work that way. The drive itself independantly looks for and reads the barcode, the gamecube itself has nothing to do with it and has no control over it. Once the barcode is read and verified, the dvd drive hands control over to the gamecube where game loading takes place. They are not related or connected in any way.

    What is happening with regards to hacked bioses is that after the dvd drive reads the barcode and it turns over i/o function to the gamecube, the hacked bios stops the drive without triggering a reset and delays gamestart allowing you the chance to swap discs. It's a kludge.

    The gamecube side of things doesn't know anything about the existance of the barcade. There is no information it can read or store regarding the barcode. This is all being handled exclusivly by the DVD drive internaly. Only thing the gamecube knows is if the dvd drive is on-line or not.

    Easiest way to look at it is that the dvd drive and gamecube are two totaly seperate and independant devices that function automonously from one another and do nothing more then talk to each other when able. The dvd drive won't start talking however till it's initalized, and it won't initalize till it verifies a badcade. Once it start talking, it will keep doing so till something triggers the drive to reset, at which point it shuts up and tries to initalize again.
     
  8. Squished

    Squished Member

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    In essence, what you suggest has already been done. You can buy the Action Replay for the GC and boot it up and then load a replacement bios from a memory card. That avoids the need for PSO and BBA... although I'm not sure what is involved in getting the replacement BIOS loaded onto the Action Replay memory card. You might need to know someone with a PSO and BBA.



     
  9. Ize

    Ize Regular member

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    Alright, well maybe thats the next step. A mod that controls the laser assembly and bypasses the check and automatically tells the cube it's all go.
     
  10. L-Burna

    L-Burna Active member

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    Nah Squished that is not what I mean,what I was trying to say is a pressed direct boot disc.I am not saying store anything on a memory card,or anything like that.I don't know I thought it would be cool,but I don't think there will be a direct boot method without a modchip.I think maybe in the future,but not anytime soon.If someone could make a pressed GCOS disc or even Cobra or something of the sort,that would be the shiznit no lie.I think everyone will still need the BBA any way they go,but still it isn't a bad thing to stream some stuff.I think as for the modchip,if it was a direct boot modchip more wires would be involved.To gain more access of the motherboard,and would make it harder for some people still this is just an opinion.It would be cool to see a direct boot modchip real soon though.I think there will be more wires,but I could be wrong and I hope I am if one does exist.
     
  11. indienemo

    indienemo Guest

    This thread is about a creating a swap free bios, not about the current method...

    Back on topic:

    So let me get this straight, all the protection the Gamecube uses is a barcode burned onto the game?

    If this is the case couldnt we use a new lightscribe drive to burn a copied barcode onto a burned disc?
     
  12. L-Burna

    L-Burna Active member

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    Actually what you said is true and false indienemo,the barcode is a factor no doubt.I don't think it is possible though without the proper equipment bro.Nintendo uses a specialized press machine just like PS2 and Xbox uses.The data is pressed on the discs,if you look at the discs they are pressed man.Silver bottom discs give it away man,they have to be using a press machine.In order to accomplish this you would have to know the encryption tables they use,and have a pressing machine.I am sure the barcode is a factor also,which would set in the encryption table how the disc are pressed.
     
  13. indienemo

    indienemo Guest

    Looks like a dead end there man, Nintendo have some good security on this console, its far more effective than PS2 or X-box look how easily they're modded
     
  14. L-Burna

    L-Burna Active member

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    Yeah I know man,the reason why is becuase Nintendo has Sega working with them man.That really is double the protection to be honest.Ever since Nintendo bought Sega up the protection has been very hard to break.When they bought Sega all the developers that work for Sega have been helping Nintendo out on cracks that have been used on the dreamcast and so forth.I am actually suprised PSO 1&2 first release and BBA work for the GameCube,but they did fix this issue real quick by fixing the flaw and distributing a different version of the game PSO Plus.The copy protection is getting really hard to crack now.I agree with you PS2 and Xbox do have very little protection,but it didn't take long to pick up on their protection.The encryption for GC and Xbox are kinda the same though as for picking them up with the computer,if you insert the disc into your computer.Your drive will not pick them up,some people have said clonecd works picking up these discs.I am still uncertain if it works or not,but my drive doesn't work picking up the discs.That is some pretty harsh protection though,to make the drive not even pickup the discs.You also have to think about how long PS2 and Xbox have been around,before GC came out.The GC came out a year after PS2 and Xbox were released.I have to admit they where smart to wait and see what happened to PS2 and Xbox before actually applying their protection.The press machine though is used on all the systems so far.They all have different encryption tables though,which is where they differ.With PS2 it is pretty simple,since this was the first one to be released out of these 3.You can pick these up with no probs.Xbox got pretty smart and began to increase the protection a little bit.Then GC came out with the full blown protection from looking at these two consoles.This is the way I see how the copy protection was looked at between these three consoles.I can't even imagine how hard it would be to crack the next gen consoles copy protection.They are supposed to be released not that far from now also. o_0 Doh!!!
     
  15. indienemo

    indienemo Guest

    Itll suck if the next gens come out and all the gamecube isnt fully hacked yet...

    And by fully hacked I mean:

    1.) Swap free bios
    2.) No more DRE's
    3.) Optional extra's like HDD support, Full size covers etc.
     
  16. Squished

    Squished Member

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    L-B, I wonder how reputable the Datel people are that created Action Replay? Do they have a GC DVD authoring station capable of glass masters that have the barcode? Some have made them out to be a rouge company that didn't get any approval from Nintendo.
     
  17. indienemo

    indienemo Guest

    I have no idea, but I know they release games without a license from nintendo...
     
  18. Artlover

    Artlover Member

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    It's not the only protection, but is the the most signifigant one. Other protection is the custom data format and encryption, but those are software issues that have already been addressed. Currently, the BCA barcode is the last remaining hurdle.

    It might possibly be possible, but not out of the box, thats for sure. That lightscribe stuff only does labling using special discs. It doesn't seem to have the capacity to do this special burning on a data side, nor does it seem like it would be capable of producing the type of burning required. It also doesn't seem to actually be burning the label in the same mannor that the data side is burned, but rather reacting with the special label coating, so it's questionable if it would even be able to burn/mark the media layer at all even if you could trick it into trying.

    Barcoding is done by a special BCA machine that actually over etches straight lines across the disc in the area before and partialy over-writting the lead-in. section. It's pretty specific.

    On a more positive note, it does look like it physicaly tracks across the disc to the area were the BCA barcode would need to be. So if it could be hacked to try to burn the media side and if it's capable of actually burning the media layer and if the resolution is high enough that it can generate pesudo straight micro fine lines, it could theoricly be possible. It's an idea that some professional hackers should probably throw around. :)
     
  19. Squished

    Squished Member

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    I believe what you want is a drive capable of tatoo, not lightscribe. Lightscribe writes to the backside, tatoo writes to the data side. For all we know, they may work exactly the same. Has anyone tried to lightscribe the data side of a DVDR or CDR?

    I think the far bigger problem is getting a DVD burner to be able to write in the lead-in area at all. I'm betting it is beyond the physical reach of consumer DVD burners (too close to the hub).

    Also keep in mind that many blank DVDR producers burn product run numbers into that same area used by the barcode. You would have to find media that has NOTHING burned in that area. Looking at the Ritek Mini DVD-R's, I don't see anything, but I do see run numbers on just about every other DVDR I have. (Look VERY carefully, even in good light it can be hard to see the numbers.)

    We'll find out it is simply the same technology that writes the run number into the lead-in area, but just using a barcode font with the text "Nintendo Rulz" or some such nonsense ;-)
     
  20. Artlover

    Artlover Member

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    Missed a few messages. Ah well, better late then never.

    I wouldn't say that. Look at the PS2. Smallest mod chip is 11 wires, and still needs to be used with a boot disc. 17 wires for the smallest no-boot-disc chip. And that's with most of the connections being half the size of the GC bios chip. Not easy at all, and works because it ties into everything, bios, drive, etc..

    Sega Saturn also uses cd specific protection and has a chip that actually plugs inline between the cd drive and main board to intercept and spoof cd verification.

    PSX chips are easy. 4 wire chips, that basicly tie into the drive side of things and dump a generic cd key into the system. No bios replacement is needed since the discs arn't encrypted and dont use any propriatory format.

    They all share the same common trait however, they spoof cd verification at the source before it gets to the system itself.

    There is no reason it can't be done on the GC. Already got the bios replacement part done. Just need a chip with atleast 2 more wires that connect to the drive. I firmly believe it will happen, and probably not too much longer either.

    The xbox is a different beast as it doesn't have any disc specific protection like PSX/PS2/Saturn/GC. It's all software related using RC4 encryption and propriatory data layout, which is why it was easily hacked with just a bios replacement, which also is a bit more involvled then the current GC mods (unless you do a tsop flash method which is hella easy).
     

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