Discussion in 'DVD Shrink forum' started by ClipsKid, Jan 11, 2006.
I'm glad you got your extra's bro bear!
Likely story, the cat's outta the bag. I heard that was one of the tales presented as an unknowing accomplice was dragged to the torture chamber where the nice thought police were going to give him a nice dip in the sensory deprivation chamber. LOL
Which ones? The ones in the movies or all the extra software cluttering up my hard drive?
You mean the backups in my video library? My buddies have all been dragged away and I'm left here alone. LOL Those drunks don't mind being in a tank. LOL
There are no set rules, a PGC chain can vary in structure by DVD all you have to do is make sure of the starting and ending sectors and that the chains link to the proper cells. Note in the column to the right you see PGC chains and cells listed. In this sample you'll note that the PGC chains are linked to the title menu (note no segments listed). This is only a small view of the actuall PGC chain. What's funny is if you go to the title menu and search the buttons the PDC chains associated to them vary. For instance the fist button could be linked to PGC 8, the second button to 5, the third to 13 and then when you access another part of the menu you geta whole new set of buttons that might link to 4,7, and 14. It's following the PGC chains that I'm able to preview chunks of the movie to locate certain scenes to make screen savers with. BTW, free apps such as PGCedit give you very little access to a DVD's overall structure.
I didn't mean no harm but it seems I've upset the masses as usual??
I thought I saw a way to add another stream of knowledge buried in this thread!
although bro bear seems to be tanked or something lol I said don't drink the punch but that was pages ago!
I'm just joking bro but I must say it's good to see you jovial!
seems it has been a while since I've seen the wild bear around!
An IFO isn't a part of the chain it is nothing more than a set of instructions or an overview of the movie that gives directions as to how it's played. The cells are part of the chain and the starting sectors gives it a go ahead. Break the chain and nothing will play, lose the IFO and you can create another in minutes.
a set of instructions that do what??
Made sense to me.
The reason is that DVD Decrypter version 126.96.36.199 does not show encryption keys. Try it out and see if you want. I can send you the program if you'd like.
Only cells which did not contain any data or data that was corrupted was removed. The encryption remained on the DVD, but ARccOS is [bold]not[/bold] Encryption.
You are correct that more software can help rip the movie, but if you have a DVD Ripper without CSS support, the DVD would be scrambled or it would not rip. However, this is not editing. Removing ARccOS is different than editing because the original movie remains untouched. Only stuff that was added after the DVD was authored is removed. Even unencrypted DVDs can have ARccOS or Ripguard. I actually have a DVD that has Ripguard, but did not have any encryption (Landscapes in the Mist).
I meant that people are having problems even when they use programs like AnyDVD and DVDFab. The part referring to IFO mode was just reasoning why IFO Mode will not fail on a DVD. Basically IFO Mode allows you to manually skip empty sectors on a DVD. These sectors cannot be ripped no matter what software you have.
Also, if you use a PSL file or AnyDVD, etc..., you are basically doing the same. The cells are never ripped.
The original source is not edited, only what was added by Sony DADC is removed. This is not part of the original movie and was not intended to be part of the movie. It does not contain any different encryption or any video, etc... It is just a blank spot on a disc. No matter what program you use, there is no way to read something that is not there.
Here are logs with DVD Decrypter 188.8.131.52 and Resident Evil Apocalypse. The first is one where DVDD does not check for structure protection. I am only ripping cells 1 through 10, with cell 10 being the first non-corrupted cell:
I 02:12:35 Operation Started!
I 02:12:35 Source Device: [1:0:0] _NEC DV-5700A 1.91 (G (ATA)
I 02:12:35 Source Media Type: DVD-ROM
I 02:12:35 Source Media Region Code: 1
I 02:12:35 Source Media Copyright Protection System Type: CSS/CPPM
I 02:12:35 Source Media Implementation Identifier: SONY DVD Video
I 02:12:35 Destination Folder: E:\DVD_VIDEO\VIDEO_TS\
I 02:12:35 File Splitting: By Cell ID
I 02:12:35 Read Speed: MAX
I 02:12:35 Check For Structure Protection: No
I 02:12:35 Detect Mastering Errors: No
I 02:12:35 Remove Macrovision Protection: Yes
I 02:12:35 Stream Processing: No
I 02:12:37 [bold]Decryption Key: D5 CA 6F 01 9D[/bold]
I 02:12:37 Extracting Sectors...
W 02:13:06 Failed to read Sector 192543 - No Seek Complete
W 02:13:13 Failed to read Sector 192544 - No Seek Complete
I 02:13:14 Abort Request Acknowledged
W 02:13:20 Failed to read Sector 192545 - No Seek Complete
E 02:13:20 Failed to Extract Sectors!
E 02:13:20 Operation Aborted! - Duration: 00:00:44
E 02:13:20 Average Read Rate: 371 KB/s (0.3x) - Maximum Read Rate: 1,638 KB/s (1.2x)
This is to show the Decryption Key before the first real cell begins. BTW, the failures are on cell 8 (this means this is the first empty cell. You can test cell 9, but it is unnecessary except for information).
Now here is a log of DVD with only ripping cells 10 & 11 of chapter 1. Basically if the guide were followed (slow rip speed is due to multitasking):
I 02:16:21 Operation Started!
I 02:16:21 Source Device: [1:0:0] _NEC DV-5700A 1.91 (G (ATA)
I 02:16:21 Source Media Type: DVD-ROM
I 02:16:21 Source Media Region Code: 1
I 02:16:21 Source Media Copyright Protection System Type: CSS/CPPM
I 02:16:21 Source Media Implementation Identifier: SONY DVD Video
I 02:16:21 Destination Folder: E:\DVD_VIDEO\VIDEO_TS\
I 02:16:21 File Splitting: By Cell ID
I 02:16:21 Read Speed: MAX
I 02:16:21 Check For Structure Protection: No
I 02:16:21 Detect Mastering Errors: No
I 02:16:21 Remove Macrovision Protection: Yes
I 02:16:21 Stream Processing: No
I 02:16:24 [bold]Decryption Key: D5 CA 6F 01 9D[/bold]
I 02:16:24 Extracting Sectors...
I 02:18:47 Operation Successfully Completed! - Duration: 00:02:26
I 02:18:47 Average Read Rate: 1,650 KB/s (1.2x) - Maximum Read Rate: 1,809 KB/s (1.3x)
The decryption keys are the same. Here is cell 8 alone:
I 02:20:00 Operation Started!
I 02:20:00 Source Device: [1:0:0] _NEC DV-5700A 1.91 (G (ATA)
I 02:20:00 Source Media Type: DVD-ROM
I 02:20:00 Source Media Region Code: 1
I 02:20:00 Source Media Copyright Protection System Type: CSS/CPPM
I 02:20:00 Source Media Implementation Identifier: SONY DVD Video
I 02:20:00 Destination Folder: E:\DVD_VIDEO\VIDEO_TS\
I 02:20:00 File Splitting: By Cell ID
I 02:20:00 Read Speed: MAX
I 02:20:00 Check For Structure Protection: No
I 02:20:00 Detect Mastering Errors: No
I 02:20:00 Remove Macrovision Protection: Yes
I 02:20:00 Stream Processing: No
I 02:20:02 [bold]Decryption Key: D5 CA 6F 01 9D[/bold]
I 02:20:02 Extracting Sectors...
W 02:20:28 Failed to read Sector 192542 - No Seek Complete
I 02:20:31 Abort Request Acknowledged
W 02:20:34 Failed to read Sector 192543 - No Seek Complete
E 02:20:36 Failed to Extract Sectors!
E 02:20:36 Operation Aborted! - Duration: 00:00:35
E 02:20:36 Average Read Rate: 454 KB/s (0.3x) - Maximum Read Rate: 1,389 KB/s (1.0x)
Again, the same decryption key, yet DVD Derypter could not rip the whole cell. This is because beginning at sector 192542 of the disc until 200737 there is no data on the DVD. When you launch AnyDVD, the corrupt cells are hidden from DVD Decrypter:
This is because they are not actually part of the movie, so they will not be ripped.
It is also possible to follow the guide in File Mode, however, it will take to long for Decrypter to get past all of the empty space on the disc. IFO Mode allows you to completely skip this area, so the result will be a faster rip. With AnyDVD, you are still ripping about the same amount as with IFO Mode. AnyDVD only skips past the unreferenced cells. This is also possible in IFO Mode, but not necessary, since the referenced cells are also garbage, also doing this will require you to analyze the complete IFO structure which does take some time.
Again, skipping cells in the first chapter that are part of ARccOS is not the same as editing the DVD. Also, a different Encryption is not bypassed. When you rip following the guide I wrote, you actually get what the original DVD was intended to look like (structurally, visually both are the same). This is because the ARccOS is almost reverse engineered out of the DVD.
You said you lost some special features when you ripped TND in IFO Mode, but did you also rip the rest of the disc? What about the other PGCs in the VTS if there are any? IFO Mode only rips 1 PGC at a time. You would have to demux and remux in order to keep the extra features of the same VTS (obviously a bit more goes into it, but that is basically what happens).
I do have a better understanding of the structure, but if I would have gone deeper than what I wrote in the guides, it would only lead to confusion. It is easier to just follow directions than to figure them out. I only went a little into figuring out which cells to skip. However, rather than showing how to find ARccOS by analyzing the IFO Structure, I gave a simple solution, do not rip what is not part of the movie. Maybe it would be less confusing for people if I post the guide I wrote using The Cave??? I used DVD Decrypter version 184.108.40.206 for that guide, so it shows the decryption keys and there is less fuss with IFOEdit.
The corruption is actually very easy to spot. The first cell of a movie will be longer than a few seconds. Also, actual movie cells will be in successive playback and there will not be any pauses in between cells of actual movie. Bewitched for example, threw some video clips in random parts of the movie but these were followed by blank cells. When unchecking cells, you uncheck those that are too short to contain video and those that are followed by something too small to contain video. Another method is to do a test rip of Chapter 1 and splitting by Cell ID. You can then play back every cell one by one using Media Player Classic to see what they contain. Also, the cells that do no contain any Data will not rip, so that is one way to find exactly which cells have the ARccOS coruption.
Thanks for all that info on Nero Recode!!! That is great to know and it will be very useful.
okay not such a quick quiz but we got there all the same!
@ jaguar god if one should choose not to learn there is no helping them!
arnie my friend thanks for spreading some knowlege I for one learned something!
so thank you arnie, as I just think that is something that doesn't get said enough in today's society! I think you've shown yourself to be a king amongst men!
It's easy to give a quiz becuase it presumes that the asker knows the answer before they ask it. But when one is on the receiving end they are bound to the language in which the question was asked and if the language is flawed then so is the question. when I get home later work how about I ask you one based solely on what I know. This can't be one sided.
Here's an info page from AnyDVD showing the encryption-copy protections used for "The Cave". Just an example to illustrate what we're talking about and one of the movies you mentioned doing with the IFO method.
Let's put this discussion to rest (it's getting a bit old), there's no magic and the modes of DVD Decrypter have to remove "protection", irregardless of what you call it. Call it copyright protection to encompass the encryption, structural protection, and bad files, sectors, and whatnot. The point is that encryption exists and has to be removed, even in the IFO mode of DVDD. Also, with later DVDs, post DVD Decrypter support, the "copyright protections" have to be manually removed. It's not exactly an easy task for the novice and as I said, they need good instructions for each separate job until they learn how on their own. Then if the user wants the rest of the extras, those have to be selected separately and ripped to the output file using the File mode. At least that is the method some use. As I pointed out, that protection is being edited. Up to date software doesn't require the work. Frankly, I think it's more work than it's worth as long as free programs such as DVDFab Decrypter will do the task with one click. Editing is nice to have in reserve, if the need ever comes up, but not what I would suggest for the newbies. I have a 100% record doing backups so far and the only time I've used IFO is practicing for familiarity. I find other methods easier. Even you will have to admit when a one click app does the job properly, that's the easiest way to go.
In the end, like most things, the DVD Decrypter mode to use depends on the strategy the user wants to follow. All modes face encryptions and copy protection. ISO is most compatible for burning, Files are easier for use with a lot of available programs, and IFO is handy for editing inside DVD Decrypter. It's nice to have the choices and each emphasizes something a bit different. When the software was up to date, it made no difference what mode one was in, the "encryption-copy protection" was automatically removed. Post support, it takes different strategies; i.e. other software to do the decryption, and protection removal and/or manually editing. It's up to the user to decide the strategy he wants to take. Once again, I'll just state editing is the more complex method and not newbie friendly. On newer "protections" IFO won't work unless the user edits. In a similar fashion the user can edit or use other software to rip files to the HD with DVD Decrypter in ISO and File modes. There are no "magic" modes and to say IFO works when File and ISO doesn't is a bit misleading.
I missed the arguement on that one but indeed this is true!
the majic?? ifo parsing is far from majic infact I think the "majic" is sold by other companies!
if seeking majic look not to dvdd any mode! it's a piece of art, but majic wand it's not, that's exactly the point!
I like your summary!
Absolutely correct! Remember the actual rip can't occur in any mode using DVD Decrypter until the encryption keys are removed and they are removed prior to any rip attempt or it won't work in any mode.
Think of it as ABC, A.The keys are hidden or removed B. The chosen method of rip activates/begins C. The file is dropped on your hard disk minus the encryptions.
ok tried decrypter with shrink again to back up a movie called Undead and it failed with verbatim dvd-r I give up this i/o magic burner has completly turned to crap i need to buy a new burner
don't mind the rantings of us tired souls where did you get the error??
ripping, conversion, burning what are you using to burn?
if your using decrypter give us a log! include anything else you think might give us a clue as to where your problem is!
but don't forget the log!
That was a fairly recent release on DVD. Decrypter may not handle the "protection" on the DVD. As an easy check, download the trial AnyDVD from http://www.slysoft.com/ or the free DVDFab Decrypter from dvdidle.com. With AnyDVD, rip with DVD Decrypter and then open the ripped files with Shrink. Same for DVDFab Decrypter, open your ripped files in Shrink and transcode.
If you have a hardware problem, then that's fodder for a different thread. Like L8ter said, we need to know where in the backup process the failure occurs.
First time posting, but I have been trolling for a while now since I switched from CD backups to DVD backups.
1.) How can one discover ARCcoS (or however it is capitalized) in a movie in general by using a program such as DVD Decrypter, and then VobBlanker? I noticed a tutorial that was written by Alkohol on how to get by the protection on the Cave and the Fog, but was wondering how those specific files were discovered for blanking. In other words, please teach me to fish, as opposed to handing me the fish. Although, thanks for handing me the fish too in the first place.
2.) It seems that DVDFab Decrypter may be the new free tool of choice, replacing DVD Decrypter, due to the new arccos scheme. Is there any tool other than this that is free that can also do all movies up to this point that is more widely recommended?
3.) I have noticed alot of people saying DVD Decrypter is what is used to burn, not Shrink. How is this the case? Once I have a movie with copy protection stripped, I click the DVD Shrink 3.2 icon on my desktop, click open files, and then backup, I never touch the DVD Decrypter program, yet Nero launches and burns my movie. How is it that DVD Decrypter is getting credit for this and not DVD Shrink?
Currently, my algorithm for burning movies is this:
1.) Examine back of movie box for words "Sony", "Columbia", or "Tristar" and that little logo of two discs with the circle and slash trough it.
a) If any are there, type movie name into Google, and pray for tutorial.
b) If not there, run Shrink.
2.) If that works, then I eat popcorn. If not I run DVD Decrypter, then Recode 2 on the results of that. And the eat popcorn.
3.) If that doesn't work, I repeat step 1a.
The goal fo this post, is to eliminate step 1a. I appreciate any input you may have.
1. applications such as AnyDVD can report different file protections. The best bet is to assume that all DVDs contain the latest protections then you won't find out the hard way.
2 DVDfab is new and perhaps in time it will prove to be the best choice but for now DVDdecrypter is still the number one choice of the experienced. It can be updated ro skirt the latest protections using PSL2 files. http://www.dvdhounds.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2477#post2477
3. DVD Shirnk doesn't burn anything it's a transcoder that can rip some movies and compress virtually all movies to fit onto a single type 5 disc. Shrink can also compress the DVDs into ISO format and then it can interface with DVD Decrypter which can not only rip DVDs but it can also burn ISO files (It's now been updated to image burns that burns but can't rip).
Now to your algorithm.
Your first step step should be to rip with DVD Decrypter and the second should be to use the transcoder of your choice, the third and last should be to burn. If DVD Decrypter can't rip it then go to the link above and it will help guide you.
Or if you get frustrated, DVDFab Decrypter is currently up to date. That has been my only fault with the app, it's slow to be updated sometimes. AnyDVD is the quickest for updates, but with some of the later releases, using it with DVD Decrypter (for ripping to HD) leaves the files slightly noncompliant. Shrink will transcode and do the minor repairs, but some software refuse to finish due to the errors. I always leave the methods involving editing as the last resort. It's a handy skill to have, for those times you may have trouble with the software on a particular movie. So follow Sophocles advice and give it a shot. Just remember if you get hung, DVDFab Decrypter is working for the time being at least.
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