Fact: CMC's Lin-Kuo Factory II and III make Verbatim discs in Taiwan. Fact: CMC uses Mitsubishi stampers "MCC" and Mitsubishi dye. Conclusion: 1) either everything CMC makes is not garbage, or 2) Verbatim is garbage. I think only #1 can be supported. (That would indicate that it truly is an opinion, not a logical conclusion, that CMC products are low-grade media. Fact: Mitsubishi has no disc factory in Taiwan. Fact: RicohJPN is made in Taiwan by Ritek. I see from the postings that no one bothered to look up Understanding & Solutions' analysis of factory output and market share. Someone did look up a store's claim. Very impressive. I don't suppose anyone looked up exports of granular dyes. (You do know that the dyes are granular, of course. This export information is difficult to find, but it is fact.) I leave false claims and rumors to the stores and digitalfaq. The information I work with comes from the suppliers of manufacturing equipment, test equipment, industry analysts, and government agencies. "CMC would want any AD'ers in their Qaulity Control department." Ironic. Afterdawn people are passionate about their hobby. Passion can be misleading unless tempered by some logic and factual information. The loudness of the shouting is no indication of the accuracy of the shouts. It is fine and accurate to say that Taiyo Yuden and Verbatim are excellent media and to recommend them to users because of the quality and the compatibility of the discs. It's also nice to support one's religion. But to condemn all others to hell is neither nice nor theologically sound. I don't want to change anyone's mind about TY or Verbatim, but the non-technical and incorrect attacks on other brands is troubling. Shouting about TY's and Verbatim's quality is a good thing. Shouting down other brands and the people who have had good experiences with them is not.
All i know Ryan is memosux sux!!!,you know the proof i have,mine and thats all i need OR care about!!!
Joe - i've said it over and over and over again; the majority of members here are not the same as the same as at (for instance) cdfreaks site; they over there revel in trying out all manner of discs and quality scanning like it's going out of fashion; plus analysing hub codes to verify what company/factory made certain discs etc. All very good stuff and certainly if i myself want to backtrack a hubcode to see who really made the discs i go mooching on cdfreaks. However we (in the main) over here are just out to get people burning, and burning [bold]consistently[/bold]. I don't think anyone here claims to be a fraction as expert as (for instance) cdfreaks when it comes to the ins and out of discs. We just point people in the direction of consistent discs (that we prefer to use ourselves, after using lesser stuff ourselves also). We're not here to care or wory about the profits/reputation of whatever company/brand - we're not actually advertising for or against the companies - we couldn't care less about the companies themselves, we just want to use the companies products
[bad southern baptist accent] Amen brother Creaky, you have shown us the light, Begone the demon of bad burning, Begone the demon of pixelation. I command you CMC demon back to the bowels of hell from where you came. Never darken our burner trays with possesed spawn of Satan disks.[bad southern baptist accent] 'nuff said.
wheres Kivory666 when you need him lol. he would set our buddy joe straight lol. hopefully creaky got though to him
Joe, post me some of thosed links with the facts you talk about. I not so narrow minded that I won't look at your facts. If you can show me where I've errored, I'll stand corrected. Back up your facts with the links to them.
For all those who want to burn consistently on almost every drive, Verbatim and Taiyo Yuden are the best choice. For those who want to condemn CMC or any other manufacturer/brand on the basis of logic or "facts," you must get the premises correct or your conclusions will be wrong. For anyone interested in data, here is some production information: DVD production in 2005 (all types) CMC 408 million Ritek 378 million Taiyo Yuden 320 MBI 200 Optodisc 200 Prodisc 192 Princo 180 Daxon Tech 156 Hitachi Maxell 130 TDK 79 Anyan Feiying 55 Gigastorage 50 Production figures in 2006 will be in the same order and higher except that Jiling Qingda in China is expected to be #10 with 85 million. Production by country: (9,146 million units total in 2005) 54% in Taiwan (22 factories) 10% in Japan (7 factories) 32% rest of Asia (30 in China; more than 17 in Hong Kong; 3 in Thailand; 6 in India; 3 in Korea; 4 in Singapore; 3 in Malaysia; 1 in Macau) 3% in Western Europe (5 active factories; 13 closed and not producing) 1% in rest of world (more than 6 in S. America; 2 in Middle East; 3 in Eastern Europe; 1 in USA) Not one of these factories is listed under Mitsubishi Kagaku Media, Verbatim, or Mitsubishi subsidiaries. Source: http://www.uands.com/ This report may or may not be available to non-subscribers. For those who do want marketing information for the entire storage industry, there are two sources in addition to Understanding & Solutions--Santa Clara Consulting and Magnetic Media Information Services. The website for Santa Clara Consulting is being rebuilt, but DVD Tracker is their report detailing market shares and projections for optical discs and drives/recorders. http://www.mmislueck.com/ is the link for MMIS, a knowledgeable source of information on magnetic as well as optical storage with lots of market data and production information. For information about test equipment, testing standards, and how to determine QUALITY, check out: http://www.audiodev.com/ Audio Development produces the test equipment used by virtually every manufacturer capable of making a good disc or a drive. It is the world standard. (Although NIST's Fred Byers has told me that even their equipment does vary a bit, and work in the OSTA group is beginning to determine how much variation is considered serious. The head of the Santa Clara Group is the president of OSTA.) http://www.mscience.com/ A great site explaining quality parameters. Jerry Hartke's contention is that there are two major causes of disc problems often ignored--file corruption and recording at too great a speed (pit morphology problems.) For information concerning optical discs: http://www.memorex.com/downloads/whitepapers/WhitePaper_Optical_Media_Jun06.pdf This is downloadable pdf file. Forget that it's from Memorex--this file is must reading for anyone who wants to know about optical media instead of rumors. The best written, most accurate, most comprehensive information from MiniDiscs to Blu-ray (and no commercials). http://www.osta.org/technology/dvdqa/ An excellent primer on optical discs. This is shorter and less comprehensive than the Memorex reference file, but it is worth reading for anyone interested in learning accurate information. http://eta-optik.com/fix/index-company.htm Some heavy reading from one of the major producers of manufacturing equipment. This may be too deep for non-engineers; but if you read through the Memorex reference file first, these papers will make sense. To summarize my point all along: just because a disc does not work on a drive does not mean either one of them is defective. Other factors may be and usually are involved. If CMC makes Verbatim discs (it does) and if Verbatim discs are good (they are), CMC can make good discs. If CMC's discs do not work on a person's drive, one cannot claim there is anything defective about the disc until one identifies the cause of the problem from one of the following: -compatibility issues with the drive -file issues -differences in dyes (not all CMC lines use MKK or azo-cyanine dye, but the Imation, TDK, Memorex discs do, and I believe that also applies to Philips and HP. Fuji discs use Fuji's Oxonol dye.) -differences in groove geometry in the stampers -differences in the vacuum chamber targets -differences in the processes (from manufacturing equipment, mold and curing times, personnel(manufacturing and packaging), clean room conditions, and materials such as lacquers Since there are people who experience few to no problems with CMC or CMC-derived discs, there is some evidence that the cause of the problems may lie in conditions other than the discs unless one can define what is out of specification or physically flawed on the disc. (The links to Audio Development, Media Sciences, and Steag Optik are good sources of information on what to look for even if you don't have test equipment. Their papers describe the symptoms.) If you have problems with CMC, Ritek, TDK, or other brands/manufacturers, switch to Verbatim and/or TY. Those who love TY and Verbatim ought to keep on recommending them to others--they will work for just about everyone (once TY works out some kinks in the new 16X DVD+R). But please don't accuse any disc of poor quality unless you can define what is wrong and eliminate compatibility as the cause. (I personally don't care about any particular company's product, but I do dislike the way certain brands are intentionally made to look bad by some drive manufacturers who play politics at consumers' expense.) People can read and learn in order to draw better, more knowledgeable conclusions; or they can howl with the horde. I hope these links will help the passionate AfterDawn readers move away from name calling.
I have found the best to be Ritek DVD - disks.Since I have been using them I have had around 5 failures in 700 burns.Can really reccommend them at $30 for 50 they are a good buy.
$30 for 50 is expensive for this brand. Check these places: http://www.supermediastore.com/dvd-r-ritek.html http://www.meritline.com/ritek-dvd-blank-media.html http://www.rima.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=R&Category_Code=RITEK
I just wanted somewhere to cry about my recent purchase of CMC MAGs.. I looked in the store and they were blue... get home and pop it in... and IMG Burn tells me the rest of the story.. had it not been an impulse buy... I might have looked it up first... anyways... so far they have been fine.. but from all that I've read... I guess I better make coasters (philips)
@skitzy,Return them, return them now! Otherwise you'll find yourself watching Sponge Bob Square Pants and liking it! Just tell them the disks didn't burn in your system and get ahold of some of the good stuff, TY, Verbatim, Ritek, etc.
I could look it up... but I'm not shopping at the moment anyhow... so while I'm here I may as well ask... in the past I have usually gotten either Sony, or Memorex, these disc are ok right? now I do know from a glance at the guide (last week)... that each have various manufacturers... as with any large corp... but for the most part.. these are dependable disc, correct? *now I know you have mentioned Verbatim, and Ritek... and a few various other brands... but generally in my area (sheepfu**erville...a.k.a walmart land)... these two (sony and memorex) are the best deals as far as catching a good sale goes... oh yeah... and occasionally maxell
Sony good, Memosux bad. Memosux has too many people making their disks for them, a real crap shoot. However, if you get the dreaded CMC-MAG disks you have the booby prize. Most people recommend staying far away from memorex, just search for "memosux" and see what pops up. Stick with the Verbs, Sony,Taiyo Yuden, and Ritek.
