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Can i remove black bars completetly?

Discussion in 'Other video questions' started by COOLnDRE, Aug 31, 2008.

  1. COOLnDRE

    COOLnDRE Regular member

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    Hello everyone.

    You guys notice sometimes when you download files like avi, mpg or whatever, in some of those videos, you get black bars on the top and bottom?

    I use Media Player Classic and it does have an option to remove black bars and show full screen using (stretch to window) in the video fram options, but this option doesn't always work, some of the videos will have black bars on top and bottom permanently

    and same goes for DVD's, i have a 4:3aspect ratio DVD, and my monitor is a "17 inch 16:10 lcd widescreen, but no matter what i do, I'll still see black bars on top and bottom.

    so what I'm trying to say is are the black bars encoded in the videos so that you can't remove them? What about those movies you download of the torrents, why don't they have black bars but the actual DVD's you buy do have the black bars?

    thx
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2008
  2. davexnet

    davexnet Active member

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    As you say, the good quality movie torrents, do not have the
    black bars. If you convert them to DVD and play them on your
    TV you'll see black bars. In general, the encoding on the DVD
    has included some black bars in order to maintain the proper
    aspect ratio of the movie.

    Is this what you're asking?
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2008
  3. COOLnDRE

    COOLnDRE Regular member

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    kind of

    because you see, in windows media player 11, black bars are there by default so no matter what you do, they still won't go away.

    in media player classic , there's an option in video frame (stretch to window) that makes the video viewable in full screen without cutting out too much out and it removes the black bars too.

    There's just some video formats like mpg or something like that when you view them, you can't remove the black bars no matter how hard you try.

    now.... back to the dvd's... Since i have a 17"inch 16:10 widescreen monitor, will every dvd that i play on my computer show black bars? Or if i buy the widescreen dvd's, will i be able to view te full screen without the black bars?

    1 more question, say a movie you downloaded of the torrent,and say that movie didn't have black bars, if you burn that into a DVD and play it on your DVD player (on ur 4:3 TV), will it show black bars or not?

    thanks
     
  4. davexnet

    davexnet Active member

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    The software DVD player can do all kinds of tricks, but in general,
    the player tries to maintain the aspect ratio of the DVD.
    If the DVD was produced for widescreen (16/9 anamorphic) the software
    player will show the content at that A/R - it will include any black
    bars that may exist on the DVD itself. If they're there, it means
    the movie on the DVD is actually wider than 16:9.

    The torrent movies don't have black bars because somebody cropped
    them out during the avi encoding.
    If you want to create a DVD from
    these files that fills the whole screen (4:3) it is possible to
    "stretch" the height, but the problem is, when you play back
    the DVD, things will seem tall and skinny, since you disturbed the
    aspect ratio.
    On the other hand, if you encode them as anamorphic, the black
    bars can be minimized. However, to make the DVD player do what
    we want it to do (fill up more of the screen), you have to tell
    it in the setup that your TV is 16:9 WS.

    As you can see, there are many options to consider.
    PS - Another possibility for PC playback,
    I just took a look at my old Powerdvd version 3.
    It's possible to deselect "keep aspect ratio". using this, you can
    stretch the height and remove some of the black bars.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2008
  5. COOLnDRE

    COOLnDRE Regular member

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    oh, alright, i seem to understand

    just 2 more questions.

    #1) Since i have a 16:10, 17inch widescreen monitor, which is the best format DVD's i should buy that has zero or very low black bar usage.
    also, will 4:3 aspect ratio DVD's always show black bars on widescreen monitors?

    #2) I went ahead and made aspect ratio default in my media player classic settings, it seems that Tv episodes like lost, prison break, etc... all of them only have 1-2 inches black bar on the top and 1-2 inches on the bottom (so it's very minimum )

    but......... i did a test on movies, it uses more black bars(about 5-6 inches) about 3 times more black bars on movies then on tv shows (using the default aspect ratio)

    so that means people aren't cropping the torrents, they're either using widescreen format or they could be using 4:3 aspect ratio, but i couldn't tell because I'm using a widescreen monitor.
    And I use the stretch to window option in media player classic to show the full picture without the black bars. That's probably why you thought they were cropping the video?

    last question; what program do you recommend that i can burn torrent dvd rip movies into a DVD, so that i can play on my DVD player? and if i burn a 16:9 dvd movie and play it on my 4:3 TV, I'll most likely get the black bars right?

    sorry if it's a little long and confusing, I'm pretty new to this stuff
     
  6. jony218

    jony218 Guest

    It depends on how the original was encoded. I encountered this problem before and have learned what programs to use to get rid of the blackbars on avi's. Sometimes it's alot of work but I prefer my videos to fill the entire screen of my computer or regular tv.

    step 1. The only program that I have found that can turn a widescreen avi into a fullscreen DVD is convertxtodvd 3.0. I tried every avi to dvd converter and this and the obsolete winavi video converter 7.0 where the only ones that can force a ws avi into a fullscreen.

    step 2. When you get the video_ts folder, use dvdshrink to back it up into an ISO.

    step 3. Finally use the free fairuse wizard lite to convert that ISO (only works with ISO) into an avi again. Fairuse has a video preview window where you can cutout any black bars if they are still present. The reason I use Fairuse is because it will keep the video and audio in sync everytime and it has a 2-pass encoding so the quality loss will be minimal. It also has a box that needs to check that says "use tv display mode", this will only let you use the resolutions that are compatible with a regular tv.

    That's the way I do it, I'm happy with my results. I can live with the small quality loss as oppose to being distracted by the blackbars on the TV.

    Also recently I've discovered another program that shows promise in removing the blackbars directly on the AVI's. It's called avidemux 2.4.3. I'm able to crop out the video as I please but during the reencoding process the video and audio go out of sync. I haven't tried all it's features so it might be user error on my part, but you might want to give it a try, I found it to be very user friendly.
     
  7. COOLnDRE

    COOLnDRE Regular member

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    yeah... thanks for your suggestions
    What about that program Nero 8? I heard that one is popular nowadays and can it do everything you mentioned?

    but how do you know if the torrent you downloaded is widescreen or 4:3 ratio? Because if i put aspect ratio on default in media player classic, I'll still get thick black bars on the top/bottom when watching movies, but when i watch tv shows, the black bars are smaller (only 1-2 inches).

    How can i know if the movie/tv show i downloaded is in 16:9 or 4:3 format? is there a way of finding out for sure? because i never actually downloaded a video that had a fullscreen 4:3 ratio on a widescreen monitor using default aspect ratio (meaning no black bars)
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2008
  8. jony218

    jony218 Guest

    Every avi you would download is already in widescreen, but in a resolution that was encoded for viewing in a standard monitor or tv. The ones that have the blackbars were encoded in a nonstandard resolution to keep the blackbars no matter if you choose 16:9 or 4:3.

    I use gomplayer as my video player and can tell right away if it's has a good resolution or not. If you for instance choose 4:3 (including the fullscreen stretch) and you still have the black bars, than I have to perform repairs on it.

    Nero is a good program that does too many things, but is mainly a burning software. Other programs concentrate on only one thing and do a great job in their specialized area. I have my doubts whether Nero can do the repairs needed.
     
  9. COOLnDRE

    COOLnDRE Regular member

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    well... in media player classic, you can view the video in *stretch to window mode*, this is a pretty neat feature, you just set the aspect ratio to default and most movies, tv shows will display in full screen (without black bars) while you being able to view as much screen as you can(it's actually better than the 4:3, 5:4, 16:9 aspect ratios that you can choose from)



    But it's weird though, when i download Mpeg or something similar files, I'll see the black bars enabled (even if i have the video in stretch to window, 4:3, 16:9, etc..) it still won't remove the black bars. (this might be because i have a widescreen monitor, not sure)

    Same thing goes for DVD's, my monitor is a "17inch LCD 16:10 widescreen, and i found a old DVD (which was in 4:3 aspect ratio I believe) and when i played it in Media player classic or WMP11, the big black bars were on the top and bottom, i tried every possible way to remove it (even tried crop settings in ffdshow) but nothing, the black bars just stayed there.

    I just wanna know a few things, when i play dvds on my cpu, will i always get black bars? or is the reason I'm getting the black bars on that dvd is because it's 4:3 aspect ratio? If i get a Widescreen DVD (16:9 preferably) will the video be in full screen with no bars? or will the bars still be there?

    like i said, i have a 16:10 17inch widescreen monitor, can someone recommend me what aspect ratio dvd's i need to buy in order to get full picture with no bars?
    *off topic, what is actually the difference between 16:10 and 16:9, do videos work better on 16:9 or 16:10?

    thanks
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2008
  10. jony218

    jony218 Guest

    Most dvd's (the majority) will always have the black bars when viewed on a TV, some not as bad as others, because they maintain the same ratio that the director of the movie wanted. There are some rare DVD's that do have a widescreen on one side and a fullscreen on the opposite side, but you don't see too many of those.

    That's why I always shrink the dvd to an ISO, then I use fairuse wizard to remove the black bars and convert to an AVI, from there I have to use convertxtodvd to take it back up to dvd. If you get a real good avi in the 1gb range, the quality loss will be minimal. Even a 700 mb avi is passable when converted up to a fullscreen dvd.

    Some of the real old movies from the 60's are in some strange "technoscreen or ultrascreen" resolutions that have almost half the screen in blackbars, fairuse wizard can fix these movies too.

    That's probably the only way you will be able to get the video to play properly though your 17 inch monitor, through multiple conversions. It's worth the trouble to get a picture that fills the entire screen.
     
  11. COOLnDRE

    COOLnDRE Regular member

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    alright, thanks for your help.

    I'm going to download all those files as you said, but after like 3-4 days because I'm busy atm, so will you help me with step by step instructions after 3 days? Cause I'm really new into the dvd buring stuff and when i use programs i never ever used, i usually mess up
     
  12. jony218

    jony218 Guest

    1. use free dvdfabhddecryter to rip dvd.I usually only rip the main movie with the english soundtrack. If you only plan to convert to avi, you can backup to ISO staright from dvdfab.

    2. next use the free fairuse wizard lite to convert the ISO to avi. If you have the free version the h264 codec produces the best quality at 700mb. In fairuse when you get to the preview screen if the the crop dotted lines are at the blackbars you don't have to do anything, if the dotted lines are below/above blackbars than you have to manually move them up or down to cut out the blackbars. In the next screen you pick the codec and the resolution, make sure you check the box "use tv display mode". If you plan to batch process several ISO, choose defer processing, otherwise press start.

    3. To convert this avi you just made into a fullscreen dvd, use convertxtodvd 3.0, on the settings "dvd specifications" choose 4:3, and on "video processing" choose stretch video resized to fit tv screen. (this will make sure that you won't get even a stray 1/2" blackbar on the screen).

    4. If you have an avi that you downloaded with blackbars, then in convertxtodvd, you will also have to crop the blackbars, in the "tree view" click in the "video resize" words and then click on the stretch words, click on the tv icon. now you are in the cropping section, here you will crop out the black bars and get an idea of how the video will look.


    http://www.fairusewizard.com/lang_en/fairuse_wizard_dvd_divx_xvid_backup_tool_light_edition.html
     
  13. COOLnDRE

    COOLnDRE Regular member

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    hey there, sorry i couldn't reply back, been kinda busy.


    anyways, i did some kind of experiment.

    I Had a Simpsons Season 3 DVD and a Spiderman 2 DVD that was laying around my house.

    Now.... my Tv is a 4:3 Sony 27inch Flat Screen, and my monitor is 17"inch LCD 16:10 Widescreen.

    My DVD player doesn't have the option to go to 16:9 or a 4:3 resoultion (it is set by default)

    The results where;
    Spiderman 2 had pretty big black bars on top and bottom
    Same results when playing on my Computer

    The Simpsons didn't have no black bars, i could view the full screen picture
    On my computer, when i played the simpsons dvd, the black bars weren't on the top and bottom..... but..... they were on the left and right.


    I went back to my cpu and I tried tweaking both of these dvd's on my Media Player Classic and i was managed to make the Simpsons to full screen with out using having to see black bars to the left or right.

    Spiderman-2 still had black bars on the top and bottom, but i viewed it in stretch to window and changed the aspect ratio around and i was able to cut the black bars on the top and bottom significantly with out loosing any view point of the movie.

    So i came to a conclusion that that The Simpsons DVD was 4:3 aspect ratio and Spiderman-2 was 16:9 and there was no way a DVD player can change aspect ratios unless the movie has an option for it or your dvd player supports it.

    now.... back to johnny218's post;

    Since Spiderman-2 played on my TV with black bars, if i get convertxtodvd 3.0 and all those files and i crop the video, re-encode it and burn it, will i be able to see this movie on my TV/Computer with Full Screen and no bars?

    And i guess if I'm able to make 4:3 aspect ratio DVD's work in full screen on my widescreen monitor without any black bars, i guess i should buy the 4;3 version DVD's?
     
  14. davexnet

    davexnet Active member

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    Your DVD player doesn't have a choice in the setup for 16:9 or 4:3?
    I thought they all did - How does the player know what kind of TV
    it's connected to?

    When you say buy a 4:3 DVD, are you taliking about buying the
    fullscreen version of a movie Vs. the Widescreen?

    Some people prefer it, but the fullscreen version has already had
    the sides of the picture chopped off to make it fit. At least
    with your experimentation you managed to fit the WS movie (or FS)
    on your screen without black bars by playing with the aspect ratio.
    You didn't lose any picture, you just distressed the aspect ratio.

    Make sure you understand the difference, then you can decide
    what to do. We can't decide for you.
     
  15. jony218

    jony218 Guest

    With convertxtodvd you can take your widescreen video_ts folder and use those vob files as the input video. This way you will get the best quality fullscreen dvd. In the video resize method you will choose "user :cropping and padding are user defined" doubleclick on the tv icon and it will take you to the cropping window, here you move the picture up/down to fill all the black bars, next press ok. Make sure and press the green checkmark next to the tv icon. It wil take between 30 and 45 minutes to complete, but the finished video will be fullscreen no blackbars anywhere.

    Fairuse wizard is the want to use if you want make a widescreen dvd into a fullscreen avi (divx/xvid).

    The simpsons is a "made for tv" video, it was properly encoded to be tv friendly.
    On the otherhand spiderman is a widescreen release, convertxtodvd or fairuse wizard will easily remove the black bars from it.

    convertxtodvd - can turn widescreen dvd files or avi into fullscreen dvd.
    fairuse wizard - can turn widescreen dvd files into fullscreen avi.
     

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