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Changes to the rules and forum functions -- please read!

Discussion in 'Forum announcements' started by Ketola, Aug 16, 2004.

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  1. darthnip

    darthnip Moderator Staff Member

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    i think the rule sounds more relaxed than it really is (or at least i hope). If a person came in and said "i just downloaded goodfellas and dont know how to covert it to DVD" he would get his ass ripped by 5 people and learn nothing. The way I'm seeing the new rule, we cant just assume that this person does not own this DVD and it's really not worth watching 5 people bitch at him to find out. Just tell him we got great info here already on converting video formats so try the search function, and mention we also have a forum dedicated to backing up your own DVD's. then move along.
    Now if someone comes in and says " I got every xbox and PS2 game, and every movie in the theaters right now for $1 each", I'd probably ban them. Each situation is different and needs to be handled according to what is going on, rather than just biting someone's head off because they said they downloaded a video.
    I see copy protection circumvention discussions the same way. Almost every game, app, and DVD has some sort of protection. If I have to break that protection in order to make a backup and protect my grossly overpriced investment, so be it. But I wouldn't run around saying "hey you can go to the video store and copy every damn thing they have instead of buying it".

    I hope that made sense, i do not promote piracy. If my views on these new rules are wrong, and i'm not seeing them clearly as they are, I'm sure I will be corrected. I think the new rules are great, and I want to enforce them correctly.
     
    darthnip, Aug 18, 2004
    #21
  2. karen2003

    karen2003 Regular member

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    Darthnip, I appreciate your point of view. But my point is, if someone did what you suggested -- wrote that he'd just downloaded "Goodfellas" and asked how could he convert it -- he would now NOT be breaking any rules, so why would 5 people rip him? (And of COURSE he doesn't own it -- he downloaded it!!) Again, according to the new rules, he's now not doing anything wrong by asking how he can take his illegal downloaded movie and make it into a DVD. Unless he's making a back-up of something he owns -- in which case he won't have a bunch of .avi or winrar files or whatever -- he has done something illegal (at least in the U.S.). And anyone who tells him how to take his illegal download and make it into a DVD is, IMHO, encouraging his piracy. I don't see how there's any way around that or any other way to interpret it. People (not you specifically) might think that there's nothing wrong with piracy, but at least call it what it is.

    One quick point. You wrote that under the new rules, even if someone wrote that he downloaded "Goodfellas,"
    "we can't just assume that this person does not own this DVD." I think if someone is talking about downloading movies, of course he doesn't own them UNLESS it's a very old movie that's in the public domain & he downloaded that (and there are very few sites that offer those -- any movie that came out in the past 30-40 years would definitely not be in the public domain). All other downloads are illegal at this time, at least in the U.S. And when the piracy sites say "100% legal," they're referring to their software, which technically is legal -- they're NOT referring to what people DO with their software, whose ONLY use is piracy. It's a slippery (slimy IMO) way for the site owners to say "We have no idea what's going on, we just provide the software."

    And this is why I am extremely disappointed in the new rules. I think we're going to see a lot more pirates learning how to be better pirates, and there is now no rule at all to prevent them from doing so. For the life of me, I can't figure out why this rule was changed.
     
    karen2003, Aug 18, 2004
    #22
  3. flip218

    flip218 Moderator Staff Member

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    I like drchips way ...

    darthnip, ... the "search" function. People don't use it, and when they do it's hard to find the right thread because of how people title the threads. How many times have you seen this title "help"? And, you say move on .... if that member doesn't get the help he need, then they start multi posting.

    I do like the "report an offensive post", but I hope I don't get reported because I ask someone if they can read. Nothing is more frustrating when your helping someone and they keep asking you the same question. Some people are more sensitive than others, and some let things roll off and some don't.

    @Veblin, I don't think an icon will work either. Some can't even find the edit function.

    Last, when I post I never intend to be offensive ... so if I am I'll just have to learn from it. BTW, what happens if you are found to be offensive?
     
    flip218, Aug 18, 2004
    #23
  4. Dela

    Dela Administrator Staff Member

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    Ive said it before and I'll say it again....

    Every country in the world has gotten different laws regarding "piracy". In some countries downloading movies is completely LEGAL like Finland for example (where Afterdawn Ltd. is based). Just because the country you or I live in says its illegal doesn't mean that it should be illegal for the whole world! Regardless of the size of your country or powers that influence your laws!

    You tell Ketola to change Case 3 to prohibited, would be to ask him to remove DeCSS from the software section, any guides for DivX to DVD/SVCD/VCD etc, this is the way aD has been since the forums came and I'm VERY VERY sure it wont change unless the entire internet one day falls under 1 set of laws!
    _X_X_X_X_X_[small]http://www.BillLonero.com - Check out a true artists music!

    aD channel on IRC: irc.addictz.net #ad_buddies
    Newbie IRC Guide- http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/47221[/small]
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2004
    Dela, Aug 18, 2004
    #24
  5. karen2003

    karen2003 Regular member

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    OK, this is why I specified the U.S. AND noted that of course Afterdawn is an international forum. I know some people don't think piracy is a big deal or should be illegal. I do on both counts. I respect your opinion, I just disagree.
     
    karen2003, Aug 18, 2004
    #25
  6. Dela

    Dela Administrator Staff Member

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    As I respect yours and thats no problem at all but did you know that in some countries like i believe in finland, the recording and movie industry and compensated from the sale of CD-R's and DVD-R's? To the people of these countries, they are paying a fair price!
     
    Dela, Aug 18, 2004
    #26
  7. karen2003

    karen2003 Regular member

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    I assume you mean from the sale of CD-Rs and DVD-Rs that are downloaded? If so, that makes sense and maybe that's why it's not piracy or illegal in Finland? That's not the case here in the U.S. Thanks for the clarification.
     
    karen2003, Aug 18, 2004
    #27
  8. Dela

    Dela Administrator Staff Member

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    Im not sure how it happens all I know is that the cost of CD-R's and DVD-R's in countries like finland is very high! But you'll have to wait for one of the admins for better clarification!
     
    Dela, Aug 18, 2004
    #28
  9. dRD

    dRD I hate titles Staff Member

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    In Finland -- just like in Canada and in various other countries -- blank media, such as blank CDR and DVDR discs, carry a high levy to compensate the movie and music industries. The pricing is slightly weird, as it is based on the number of minutes you can store audio in WAV format to each media.

    So, a single DVDR blank costs something like €0.50, but in addition to that, a levy of €2.00 is added on top of the disc price. This is mandatory, whether you use the disc to store yor digital camera pics, backups or DVDs.

    But in return, downloading music, movies, etc for personal use is perfectly legal. So is making a copy of a DVD to your friend -- even making a copy of a copy for your friend (as long as it is for "close friends" only and you don't get compensated for doing the copy).
     
    dRD, Aug 19, 2004
    #29
  10. Dela

    Dela Administrator Staff Member

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    Thnx for clarifying :)
     
    Dela, Aug 19, 2004
    #30
  11. samintx

    samintx Regular member

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    This website would be shut down if there were not rules and the cheaters were allowed free rein. Frankly I would be happy if I could find a mentioned program DVDfree43. I keep getting Google and otherwise searched that refer back to these threads that only mention the program and do not lead to a download site.
     
    samintx, Aug 19, 2004
    #31
  12. jimdene

    jimdene Member

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    I like the reference to "let the moderators" make decisions, perhaps now the smart arse hypocites, who have the answers, but are not prepared to pass on to newbies, and answer with, "you are not allowed to ask this question" will pull their neck in
     
    jimdene, Aug 19, 2004
    #32
  13. tinfoil

    tinfoil Member

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    I was thinking what Karen put to words. However, as Dela points out, downloading these things is perfectly legal where AD is based so I guess it would fly here.

    As with drchips, I will keep my own council when I don't fully agree.
     
    tinfoil, Aug 19, 2004
    #33
  14. Jerry746

    Jerry746 Senior member

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    It seems to me that Case 1 and Case 5 off-set each other. Example: Someone asks for a free serial number for Nero. I can't say go to www.------.com to get the number. But someone could say "There is a bunch of good information at www.-----.com". That would be OK. If I actually typed in the ------ everyone would know exactly what that site was for. It just doesn't make much sense to me. I agree with DrChips and will have to use my own judgement on this. But I see many problems with HOW YOU READ THE RULES.

    Jerry


     
    Jerry746, Aug 19, 2004
    #34
  15. Doc409

    Doc409 Active member

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    I am pleased to see that Afterdawn is attempting to clarify the issue of piracy with what is and is not acceptable. This needed to be done. I am also pleased to see that dealing with questionable posts is now a moderator function.

    I have also noticed a growing lack of civility towards newcomers in general ... and some responses are clearly meant to be offensive towards them. I trust that the mods will also begin dealing with these situations?




     
    Doc409, Aug 19, 2004
    #35
  16. drchips

    drchips Active member

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    As Doc409 said:
    I think you may see the "offensive post" function used (abused?) as a limiting factor.

    As for jimdene:
    and this kindo of post will encourage them to assist you how???

    [​IMG]
     
    drchips, Aug 19, 2004
    #36
  17. Ketola

    Ketola Turned ninja Staff Member

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    You _can_ say "Go to whatever.com, click on 'Pirates click here'". You can also say "Go to google.com and type 'serial numbers'" to the search.

    The first case states that no pirated content can be posted to the forums. So you are not allowed to post a message with the actual serial number.

     
    Ketola, Aug 19, 2004
    #37
  18. darthnip

    darthnip Moderator Staff Member

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    thats one of the coolest things about it, it's OK to disagree. Before I actually learned how to make backups, and before I had a DVD burner, my only choice to back up my movies was to download VCD and SVCD copies. So i cant agree that someone asking how to convert something needs to be labeled a pirate. You can go to alot of websites online and even go to your local library and find information on building plutonium bombs, C4, Symtex, and various other illegal things but thats all it is, information. The library cant be held responsible if someone really decides to make some C4 and blows up their neighbor now can they? Just like you can walk into any gas station and buy rolling papers, but it's up to YOU to put marijuana in them. I do agree that the rules may need a bit of refining to be more clear for the people that dont fully understand them. but it aint like we got a banner on the front page saying "Get Your Warez Here"!
     
    darthnip, Aug 19, 2004
    #38
  19. jl802

    jl802 Member

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    How is this going to affect the "Console Backup" section? Are post referring to mod-chips, Evox, etc going to be allowed?
     
    jl802, Aug 19, 2004
    #39
  20. darthnip

    darthnip Moderator Staff Member

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    as far as I know, they always have been since you need those things the make/play backups of games you own.
     
    darthnip, Aug 19, 2004
    #40
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