convert PAL to NTSC

From what I understood, the proper way to convert PAL DVD's to NTSC is to slow down the PAL 25 fps to 23.976 fps and add 2:3 pulldown flags to make it 29.976 fps.

I have an interlaced PAL DVD 625/50 that I want to try to convert to interlaced NTSC 525/59.94.

In this case, would it be better to de-interlace, slow down 25 fps to 23.976 fps and add 2:3 pulldown flags to 29.97, or just frameserve the PAL interlaced video stream to Procoder 2?

 

What I would suggest in cases like this is to try both methods and see which one gives you the best results...

I personaly think that if you took the Interlaced pal Source file and used a Bob de-interlacer on it and then slowed it down to 23.976fps and then add the 2:3 Pulldown Flags to make it 29.976fps.....

Most of any Blurring that is caused from de-interlaceing can be cleaned up with a Sharpen filter, and you can do the De-interlaceing ,resizeing , Sharpening and slowing down the Audio and Video to 23.976fps useing AVISynth and your encoder can add the 2:3 Pulldown Flags or you can just encode it to 23.976fps and use a program Like "DoPulldown" or "Pulldown.exe" to add the Pulldown Flags....

I personally think this will produce the best results Compared to just encoding the File to 29.976fps useing Procoder because when working with interlaced Material there are more chances for Artifacts to appear and I believe this method will Plain just look a Lot better....

Let me Know how it turns out and if you don"t know how to use AVISYnth or do but don"t know of a Good script to do this for you then let me Know and I"ll post a AVISynth script that you can use to convert Interlaced 25fps pal to Progressive 23.976fps NTSC...

Cheers

 

FOR MINION:

Thanks for your help, I did what you advised and it is happening as I type this. I am using a PAL AVI file which I have already converted with Nerovision2 and burned to DVD. It is from a TV program, so the DVD is not of good quality.

Is it possible to import PAL VOB files into Vegas and convert them to NTSC VOB files?

By using the method you suggested-converting to MPEG2, doesn't the video lose quality?

Thanks again. Don't think I don't appreciate what you write, it is just that up to now I had not tried any of this, so it seems very difficult.

 

Vob files are Mpeg2 files they are Absolutly the same Exact same format but yes anytime you encode a file to any Format there is some Quality Loss the ammount of Quality Loss depends on the Quality of the encoder you use and the settings you use in the encoder....

You can Not Just encode a Vob file and then replace the VOB with the Encoded file and use the same IFO and BUP files because Vob files have Information in there header that has to corespond with the Info in the IFO and BUP files and if it doesn"t then it will not work....

You can not use Vegas to encode VOB files to Mpeg2 because Vegas doesn"t support the AC3 audio in VOB files but if the VOB file had a Different audio format Like "Mpeg 1 Layer 2" or "LPCM" then it could encode the Vob.....

You are Not going to be able to get away with doing this unless you are willing to learn how to do it properly and take the Time to Learn and to go through the Process of doing it....
If I were there with you I could Show you how I do it in Probably 20 minutes but to explain every step would Take a Really long time as there are some fairly Complex Principals involved.....

 

Ok, I will try the "de-interlace/slow down/pulldown" method first. Here is my intended workflow:

1) DVD2AVI
Load VTS_1_01, 02...06 (movie)
Audio / demux AC3
Save .d2v project

2) Create .avs script file (I could use some help here)
LoadPlugin("C:\Program Files\AviSynth 2.5\plugins\MPEGDecoder.dll")
MPEGSource("E:\Test\PAL_VTS_1_01.d2v")
Bob()
Sharpen(?) #Should it be placed here?
LanczosResize(720,480)
AssumeFPS(23.976)
SeparateFields.SelectEvery(4,1,2)
Weave() #or DoubleWeave()?

3) CCE
MPEG-2 ES Multipass VBR (2 passes)
Bitrate: Avg 4500 Min 2000 Max 9800
3:2 pulldown detection marked

4) If audio/video times are the same, author DVD;
if not, synchronize audio/video somehow...

I'd appreciate any suggestions.

 

Hi ,What you should Do in DVD2AVI is if the Pal Movie is widescreen and has Black Borders on top and Bottom then you should use the Crop Feature in DVD2AVI to crop off the Borders, this will help when you have to resize the Pal 720+576 resolution to 720+480 without affecting the aspect ratio...
Many Pal DVD"s use the NTSC resolution of 720+480 but they add a 48 Pixel Boarder on Top and a 48 Pixel border on the Bottom to make the Pal 720+576 resolution so if this is the Case with your Pal DVD then you should be able to crop off the Black Borders and be left with a Resolution at 720+480 or at least close too it....
You should also use the "Decode to Wav" option in DVD2AVI insted of the Demux option because you are going to gave to convert the AC3 to WAV/LPCM anyways because you are going to have to Stretch the audio by about 4% to make it sync up with the NTSC Video....

Also in CCE do Not select the "3:2 Pulldown Detection" setting because this is Not for adding 3:2 Pulldown it is for detecting 3:2 Pulldown in the Source file and since you are Frameserveing a 23.976fps Progressive File to CCE there is no 3:2 Pulldown in the File...

To add the 2:3 Pulldown flags in your file you will have to do this after encodeing to Mpeg2 useing a Program called "DoPulldown" which is freeware and when you use it you Just Load the Mpv file created by CCE into it and then click the "Start" button and in a few Minutes it will freate a M2V file for you with the 2:3 Pulldown flags added, There are no settings to adjust as the Default setting are set up just right....

In CCE make sure you select the "ZigZag" scanning order in the "Quality" settings and also select the "Progressive Frame Flag" option...Also In the Quality settings Disable all of the Filters accept the "Effect Restricted vertical filter" and set it to "32" and set the "Quantizer Charistics" setting to "15" and set the "Intra Block DC Precition" to "10"......

Also try a Script like this one:


LoadPlugin("C:\Plugins\mpeg2dec3.dll")
LoadPlugin("C:\Plugins\dgbob.dll")
mpeg2source("C:\Documents and Settings\Video files\test.d2v")
DGBob(order=1,mode=0)
Sharpen(0.75)
LanczosResize(720,480)*
AssumeFPS(23.976)

(*) The resizeing will depend on your source files resolution after Cropping off the Borders, If you tell me the Resolution after cropping then I can tell you how to resize it without affecting the aspect ratio....

That script will deinterlace to a true Progressive File with little or No artifacts and slow the Video down to 23.976FPS NTSC film....

After encodeing and adding the 2:3 Pulldown flags you are going to have to find out the exact length of the NTSC video file..Don"t go by what CCE says the length is because it for some reason doesn"t show the Correct length...What I do is Load the M2V Video file into "Virtual-Dub-Mpeg2" and go to "file" to "File Information" and it will display the Exact length of the Video file which you should Write down on Paper...

You can download "Virtual-Dub-Mpeg2" here :

http://fcchandler.home.comcast.net/stable/VirtualDub-MPEG2.zip

Now you are going to have to stretch the audio to the Length of the M2V video file which you just wrote down...
To do this you will need an audio editing Program called "Goldwave"....
What you do is Load the wav audio file that was decoded by DVD2AVI into Goldwave...
Then go to "Effect" to "Time Warp"...
Then select the "Length" option at the Top....
then Put the new Length that you wrote down in the space provided by the "Length" option...
Now Click "OK" and it will do it"s thing, It should only take a Couple Of Minutes...
Now go to "file" to "save as" and give the File a Name and save it as a PCM/Wav file....

Now you will have a WAV file and a M2V file that should sync up perfectly...
Now you have the Choice of encodeing the audio to Either Mpeg1 Layer 2 or Dolby AC3 or you can leave it as a wav file but that is not Practical because wav audio takes up too much space on the DVD....

If you don"t have a dolby AC3 encoder then i suggest you use "Mpeg 1 Layer 2" audio....

After you have encoded the audio to the desired format you Just Load the M2V video file and the Audio file into your favorite DVD authoring program and add your Menu"s and Chapters and author it to DVD....
I suggest useing DVDLab or some other Authoring Program that supports seperate audio and Video files like "Tmpgenc DVD Author".....

If you have any Questions let me Know....

Good Luck....Cheers

 

Well, sorry I'm late in posting this, since I haven't had access to my vomputer for awhile, but here goes:

To the PERSON who posted this CRAP: The proper way to convert PAL to NTSC is to reverse what the movie studio did in the first place by making PAL from an NTSC source...

Okay, MR. DUMBA**

EXPLAIN TO ME HOW the Movie Studio did this:

You're saying MGM, for example, took the NTSC MASTER 35MM FILM of GONE WITH THE WIND, and they converted it to a PAL 35MM FILM, then captured it to DVD?

Since when is 35MM Film in different Television FormatS?

Or, for WIDESCREEN, 70MM Film...

I can't WAIT to HEAR this explanation....

As to NTSC TV shows, I can understand that...

Most Movies are released in the UK, PAL FORMAT, before they get released in the USA.

The 35MM or 70MM FILM is RECORDED into the DV format of that country, then converted to MPEG and burned onto the DVD.

Television Standards are DIFFERENT, NOT MOTION PICTURE FILM Standards.

Gee, sorry I didn't bring any pictures home from my trip to Europe, I didn't take any extra film with me, and that DARN PAL 35MM film wouldn't work in my NTSC 35MM Kodak Camera....

I think certain people should take Motion Picture and Filmmaking Courses like I have, and actually produce videos and DVDs for a profession....

The Movie Production companies do NOT manufacture NTSC DVDs, then CONVERT them to PAL. There European Division, RECORDS the ORIGINAL FILM into PAL or SECAM DV Video, then sends the COPY of the MASTER DV TAPE to the DVD ROM manufacturing place, which then presses the DV tape onto Dual Layer DVD ROMs.

Then several months later they do the same in NTSC DV for release in this country and other countries that use NTSC.

 

Hey WMAUDIO, thanks for the handy guide on changing pal to ntsc but i have a question. When i was done converting my dvd from pal to ntsc and played it in my standalone dvd player i noticed that the sound was only 2 channel and not surround (ac3) etc. The video portion was excellent just no surrond sound only 2 channel. After going back over the steps i notice when using tmgenc dvd author that it only has an option for 2 chanell audio... hmm is this the reason my dvd is only in 2 channels? is there another dvd authoring prog that can read the outputed .m2v and wav file? seems like a waist that all the other progs in your recepie are keeping the ac3 quality then you get to authoring and it just ignores it hmm thanks for any help you can give

 

Minion, thanks for the important tips.

I´ve run into some problems with CCE, so I tried the second option - encode the PAL m2v file in Procoder, transcoding it to NTSC.

I´ve checked the Goldwave specs, but it doesn´t seem to support AC3 5ch audio. Since it is a music DVD, I want to keep the AC3 5ch audio.

The times for the (un-synced) audio and NTSC video files were the same (?), so I´ve inputted both into DVD-lab Pro and authored a DVD. Surprisingly, the sync was Ok... I believe the video was Ok for TV watching (I´m not a pro, so I don´t know what is acceptable).

Now I will re-author it, adding chapter points and a subtitle.

 

Can you guys be more specific on the actual steps to convert a PAL DVD to NTSC format. I already have all
the programs mentioned in the thread (Nero, dvd2one, superpak, decrypter, quicktime, vobmerge, power producer, virtual dub, xcopy express) now i need the know-how. I am sure many people in the forum would appreciate a more detailed explanation, like a tutorial you know?

 

I also would like to thank Minion for taking the time to post how to use Vegas 4. Your help is very much appreciated.

 

This is to Minion and anyone else who understands his process for converting PAL to VOB

I have read through many of your posts about the correct way to convert PAL to NTSC.

I'm hoping that you can help me. Of all your posts I've still not been able to figure this out.

I've got a movie in PAL VOB format that I want to convert to NTSC. I'm reading from the message created here http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/6/88644
about 3/4 the way down the page with the following date and time:
17. October 2004 @ 17:24

Is this the correct way to convert VOB files?
It really appears like you know what you're saying about slowing down the video and synching the audio up with it. I want to use this way. but by following those instructions, I think something was left out. So far what I have done is to use DVD2AVI to separate the audio from the VOB files and get rid of the borders on the top and bottom. That leaves me with 2 files: movie.d2v and movie_yada_yada.wav. You mention next to use CCE, but CCE will only open up these extensions: .ecl, .avi, .avs, .mov, .dv, .dif, and some images. It does not open .d2v files. What am I missing here?

Pardon my ignorance. I find this fascinating and am new to the world of video manipulation. Thanks for your help!

 

I have followed minion's advice and successfully reformatted van helsing went from PAL MFT VOB's to NTSC VOB set burnt it and it works great even in the crappy DVD player I have that doesn't even play some real DVD's.

I did borrow some tips from WMAUDIO for the beginning process because I don't have all the programs Minion recommends like canopus and I'm to stupid to figure out how to use avisynth lol

Also works in ps2 and xbox
_X_X_X_X_X_[small]The System Has Failed...[/small]

 

Hey minion I do have a question...

Somebody recorded a show for me from their tivo or somthing and I uploaded it to my computer...

It's in AVI format and theres like 13 episodes, the first one is NTSC but the rest of em say 23.96 or whatever in roxio dvd builder...and when I try to load em into dvd2avi it crashes or goes all wierd on me and only says the framerate...

I tryed dopulldown.exe but didn't "do" anything and same with other pulldown thing uh you mentioned both in your little how to guide lol

Please don't tell me I have to convert all 18 hours of them to MPEG cause I started to with tmpgenc and thats how long it said it would take...

it's just a cartoon-(venture bros) does animation make a difference at all as opposed to movies?

sorry no time to check my shpelling.
also whats the best way to shrink a T.V. series so that it fits on a 4.7GB DVD+R
I have dvd shrink...

 

Minion, is it possible that you write a simple procedure of how to copy a DVD in Pal to NTSC and vise versa, from start to finish in the manner of wmaudio's? Don't have to be so detailed as you've to spend hours on it. Just as a starting point for newbies like me who still have problem following or making sense of what you've said in this thread.

 

hi guys,
ive been following this thread for months now and it sent me in pretty much the right direction to convert my pal dvds to ntsc....but it never works, this is what ive been doing:
i have dvd2avi to create a d2v and a wav file from my vob files
then im trying to use avisynth to do all the editing...but i need 2 plugin files, the MPEG2DEC.dll
and the SmoothDeinterlacer.dll
the problem is that there seems to be lots of different versions of these files that i can never get the ones that work together, either my avisynth version, my dvd2avi thats not making the right type of d2v files, or one of the plugins doesnt work...
this is the script i used in avisynth and it tells me it cannot open file in line 3:
LoadPlugin("c:\avisynth2\plugins\MPEG2DEC.dll")
LoadPlugin("c:\avisynth2\plugins\SmoothDeinterlacer.dll")
MPEG2Source("F:\helsing22\bleep.d2v")
SmoothDeinterlace(doublerate=true)
LanczosResize(720,480)
ChangeFPS(59.94) # or ConvertFPS(59.94)
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4,1,2)
Weave()
ConvertToRGB()

does anyone know if theres something wrong with that? or if anyone can give me a zip file with the right avisynth/dvd2avi/plugins combination that actually works along with the avisynth script to use?

 

please anyone?

 

My problem is I'm trying to convert a home video (PAL 50 fields/s) to NTSC. Obviously the source is not progressive, and I don't want to interpolate for two reasons: 1. I don't like the idea of halving the resolution (576 to 288) and 2. I want to retain the smooth 50 fields/s motion as opposed to the 25f/s (or 24f/s) filmic look.

So far, the best method I've found for converting interlaced PAL video to interlaced NTSC is by a process called [bold]motion compensation[/bold] (aka motion estimation). I can't believe this process has not yet been mentioned in this thread. This process identifies objects and their trajectories in the original video and based on this information, draws new frames.

The demo version of HiCon32 (ver 1.1.11) is the only decent program I've found that will do the conversion. However, the program is very unstable, takes up heaps of RAM and only supports a few video formats (the best of which is uncompressed RGB which takes up heaps of HDD space).

Does anyone know of another motion estimation based program that will convert PAL to NTSC (preferably one that supports DirectShow)?

 

You know, this topic truly amazes me - I've come to this thread about 15 times over the last year or so, and I am now ready to spew my frustration.

Why is the solution for converting a PAL format DVD to NTSC taking so many steps to do properly?

As a consumer, I am certainly not interested in a 8-step process on how to do this - my time is worth enough to me not to throw away several hours of it to 'possibly' make a viewable NTSC DVD from a PAL DVD source.

Is there a program that will do all of this for me:

1. Rip a PAL DVD9 or DVD5 to a local folder
2. Convert PAL video to NTSC
3. Resynch audio and subtitles if neccesary
4. Edit IFO's (and BUP's) to match VOB specs
5. Spit out a complete fully recreated NTSC format DVD5?

There has to be a package that can to this - does anybody know of one?

I do really appreciate all of the time and help everyone has dedicated to this thread, but there has to be a better way, unless you are gainfully employed as a 'proffesional videophile' or 'video editing hobbiest' an have an actual interest in this topic.

It's not my intention here to shit on anybody - only to hopefully seek out an answer I've been looking for, for over a year now.

Thank you.

 

There is Professional Software to do this, but I do not know the name or where to get it.

The ONLY way I can successfully do it, and if anyone disagrees, it's your opinion, I'm speaking from experience.

I have tried it all, and even FELL for the lies told by others in this thread.

You can use Roxio Easy Media Creator 7, Nero 6, etc., to copy the video/audio to the hard drive. I can find no way to keep the original menus, unless you do a capture of them, then use a menu editing program to set it up and redo it.

I use SONY Vegas to convert PAL to NTSC or vice versa, I have found NOTHING BETTER.

To those who may want to argue: I BOUGHT CANOPUS Hardware and Software, and I can say this, converting PAL to NTSC amd NTSC to PAL using Canopus Procoder 2.x PUTS the audio/video out of sync.

Sony Vegas 5 works flawlessly at the conversion.

I then load the video into either Pinnacle Studio 9.3 Plus to create the menus, etc., or Sony DVD Architect 2.0, if I need multiple audio and subtitle tracks.

You can change the Menu Background in DVD Architect, but I haven't found a way to lift the Buttons off the Menus on the DVDs and edit them to point to the new chapters, audio tracks, submenus, etc..

If SONY Vegas would allow the importing of VOB and IFO files, it would be the way to go, but now, you have to RIP them using another program to do it.

Canopus Procoder 2.x does a good job of importing the video, however, if it isn't set just right the resulting DV AVI is useless for editing.

Unless you're willing to buy the Professional Equipment with the Professional Conversion Software/Hardware, or whatever that does it, this is the best way to do it.

If you do a search in the search engines, you will find places that will do this, convert the entire DVD to NTSC/PAL, etc., and I mean completely. They have not answered my emails on how they do it, but maybe you can find one to tell you how they do it. My guess is they are doing it piece by piece like I do, but they are taking the extra time to edit and redo the menus, etc..