Experiencing Difficulty Using DVD RB and CCE? If So, Then Ask Your Questions Here.

Dam you got some spare time on your hands, lucky you have two!

Im also impressed you have the capability to post on two forums and two sites at the same time.

Do you realy want me to respont to that tripe?

 

You should learn copy and paste. You're crazy if you think I'd waste much time with the likes of you. You flatter yourself. It was a comment, not something you need to reply to. I put it up as something of a time line to show how quickly you became a resident expert and to show the rude and abusive behavior you've exhibited while trying to say others are guilty of turning off members. If you weren't enjoying yourself, you'd have left by now. You have an audience and don't want to let it go. I may be brusque as pointed out by some of the members, but I help others in the process. [bold]Notice who the first person was to offer you help and without any abusive behavior?[/bold] Then to see yourself on the thread, you ask about the same thing I informed you of. Talking about reading skills...

 

64026402

There are two subjects here, so Ill try to keep them seperate.

The first is my tests with muli-passes and Prec value changes.

Im happy with the Basic results, and have used it on 12 movies in my collection so far. I am however still interested in how good it can get, the very reason I came accross DVDRebuild and CCE in the first place.

And regardless of the negitive feedback I will continue to do so. I have requested an extention from CCE for the trial to test further on larger files.

As well as any information on changes to 2.70 engine.

I have continued to test while reading Brobears Novel. and have found when I encoded a dvd that gives me an average bitrate of 3 Mbit/s or above which is most of the time, at various numbers of passes, made no real difference from 1 to 6-pass VBR, both subjectively or objectively .However when again working on larger DVDs that give me an average bitrate of 2.0, 2.2 and 2.5 Mbit/s, it still improves with multiple passes. The smaller the average bitrate the more multiple passes improved the video.

In reference to Prec, a lower value (like 16) served my purpose and showed the same results I had before with noise/mosquito noise at 24 or oevr which was worse than the low blockiness I got at 16 at these low bitrates.

At higher average bit rates I saw no difference when changing the Prec to 24.

My knew tests are the same as my original post and
supports what I have said, A large DVD like the documentries of the LOTR extended
versions, the ones I tested on, showed an Overall Bitrate between 2 mbit/s and 3 Mbit/s.
The very area were others have found the same improvment with more multipasses as I did.

I have also re read the 2.70 manual and it makes no such claim to the uslessnes of multi-passes.

The second is my appraoch to Brobears manner and word usage.

I was not going to continue with the subject but since Brobear has even gone so far as to even continue on another site and thread, were in his usual manner, he has questioed my honesty and motives, just as he has with many other honest people. The very same reason I have brought up the subject in the first place.

And you guys continue to support it.

I did not respond to him in that thread nor post a link in respect for those who invited me via PM there. Its a pitty he does not have the same respect for you all.

To Doc.

"Updated encoder engine to 2.70 rev.8"

is in reference to a bug fix only

The problem was DC coefficients' value going beyond MPEG2/Video
(ISO/IEC 13818-2) standard at some situation.

Such situation occurs when there is quite low distortion and
high in contrast of luminance or chrominance.

So my results have nothing to do with a knew engine.

 

Interesting, I was almost convinced about the uselessness of too many multi-passes because "someone" claimed Cinemacraft said so... but I never checked to see if it's true.

I'm currently encoding Stargate DVD's and as you can imagine, with 3+ hours of video the bitrate goes down quite drastically and proper distribution of the available bits is VERY important.

I used to be a 9 pass fan because it didn't hurt, now I'm thinking I was right too.

Can you confirm that on DVD's THAT large 9 passes really do make a difference over say... 6 or 7?

 

Bro

No you didnt answer the question, If you felt neglected im sorry but as I pointed out there were no extras or anything to remove on the extended LOTR dvds that you suggested to improve my backup. I didnt expect you to know that but if you read the following post correctly you would have realised you did not answer the queastion.

rockas gave me an option that solved some of my problems to which I was greatfull.

A comment? Then you comments even extend to other sites and threads.

Ohh please, Bro, how old are you?

You would like me to cut and past?

 

tijgert

I have not had any intention to go beyond 6 passes, as the time is excessive. I dont have the time to test at this level.

I do however intend to do 2 passes on dvds I can decrease enough to get over the 3 Mbit/s average bit rate. A this is the limit of my software. As long as I have approval to use 2.70 I do intend to do more passes up to six as the bit rate lowers.

Ive done the whole LOTR extended versions 1 2 and 3 twelve disks. The movies showed no improvement at more than 3 passes. and even two passes was hard to find a difference from 3. I was able to decrease there size to between 5.5gig and 6.2 gig with recode and Rocas' program. The recoded menues showed little diff to the original and freed up a lot of space for the main movie.

 

Brobear Quote: "I may be brusque as pointed out by some of the members, but I help others in the process".

Yes you do, and that is something I have not achnoleged on purpose. I have been wrongly or rightly been trying to show you that you are brusque and that has resulted in the lose of memebers and contributors. If you recognise this then you will become a greater contiributor than you already are.

I can also understand the frustration of dealing with people who use cracked software, but branding or suggesting that eveyone who tries the trials has an alternative agenda, and questionaing their honesty is bordering on slander. And your recent post about me on the other forum is a prime example and duplicate of many previouse posts. Dont make me cut and past that!

just think about it.

 

Nolos,
Interesting. You can quote specs from the manual. The manual also says you can set the passes to 99. Go ahead and try it.

When Cinema Craft starts giving out the exemptions for using the SP trial indefinitely, let the rest of us know who to contact. Doc had the history on the SP. I posted earlier that the 2.7 engine has only gone through a revision, that that there appears to be no major changes. Thanks for confirming it.

tijgert
In about 20 days Nolos has become a self taught expert knowing more than the author of Rebuilder and the authors of CCE SP. Take his advice and play with the trial if you will. You'll end up wasting more time than it's worth and then it expires. Fun if you like to play with the toys, but no practical use. Watermarks. The 2 pass $58 Basic is the product that makes the usable backups unless you like the big blue logo of CCE. 16 passes or 20 or 24 makes little difference on the Quality Prec when using RB, so says the author of the app and he should know.

Basic CCE, 2 passes, 16 quality prec is the only way to go for anyone other than the rich.

 

dont remember quoting anything from the manual. as usual you have no idea what you are talking about.

I also told you I have THE BIG BLUE LOGO on my backups of the documentry, and am happy with that.

Ohh and now you agree that Quality prec 16 is the best. Although 24 makes no difference at all.

LOL

 

@tijgert

That was probably me who said it. Here is a quote from the CCE SP Manual:

"Image quality slightly improves each time encoding is repeated, but quality improvement reaches its limit at 3 ~ 4 times of encoding."

But -- there definitely isn't any harm in doing more passes.

 

Hi jdobbs

And could you confirm which manual you quoted from.

And will understand if you choose not to respond and get involved, (Although you have been quoted and used as a proof of the conta argument), but you have had contradictory tests in regards to what I have experienced in my tests.

Thank you

 

Page 25 of the CCE SP v2.50 manual.

 

Ok thank you Jdobbs, I dont think I need to go further with that.

Regards

Nolos

 

Cool.

Like I said -- there is no harm, and what is important isn't what CCE says or I say or anyone else says... it's what your own eyes tell you.

I'm not much into dictating how someone should do things... the reason I left so many things open and easy to change in DVD-RB was so people could tailor it to fit their own experiences.

 

Dont think I need to add to that either.

Thanks for you imput Jdobbs. Even if it was not as involves as I had hoped.

Regards

Nolos

 

Further responces from CCE

They have been very helpfull and quick in their correspondance to me.


CCE RESPONCE QUOTE

"I do not think 3 Mbps is enough for blockbuster DVD titles usually.

For example, Under 3 Mbps might be bonus material quality. Compressionists in Hollywood industry typically encode main feature over 4 Mbps and many passes on CCE. Even if I cannot realize any differences, they have good chops. ;-)

Anyway, you are right. Generally speaking, multi-pass has a bigger effect on lower average bitrate".

Thank you CCE,

I have further communication with CCE, but I think this should suffice for the moment.

But as jdobbs said trust your own eyes, test and see for yourselves.

 

Nolos


I realize that you've set your own standards for doing backups and you are now trying to defend them, but do you read what you've written before you post? I find your use of language offensive largely because your only goal seems to be that of proving everyone else wrong. Your CCE email post didn’t provide us with any information that we hadn’t already given you, if you’d have read it right, but you seem bent on pissing off as many people as possible rather than being a genuine contributor.

We’re all students and teachers here and the goal is to share ideas. Many of us spent the entire 2004 summer testing every transcoder and encoder available. I personally backed up LORIII using CCE more than 7 months ago and I carefully sifted through the movie looking for flaws and variations in how the bit rate was distributed. No matter how you look at it, a movie of that size leaves very little room for bit rate distribution. If the bit rates too high in too many moderate to fast scenes then the resulting backup will not fit onto a single type 5 DVD-+R so in order for this to happen something has to give up space.

I’m telling you right now that you are going to stop this nitpicking and the flaming of members. And then you’re going to realize that this thread was not started to feed your ego needs, and then hopefully you’re going to get along with everyone or go your own way.

 

Nolos

Since you are satisfied with your purchase of CCE basic and are not in the market for the 2000 dollar SP version and you have no difficulties with DVDrebuilder then your need for help is completed.

If you still wish to post about extra passes and tweaking quality out of an extended trial CCEsp version then feel free to start a thread about such.

If you wish to blow off steam at Brobear then choose a different area of the forum.

 

Sophocles,

No I have not set my standards at all, Im open to any imput. And Im not just trying to deffend my standards,

I am presenting evidance to support my findings, this is signifacantly different. Next week I may find somthing different, as may someone else, and anyone that actualy makes an effort to test the products will be welcome to present it to me.

Brobear is correct, I have been involved in CCE and DVDRebuild for a matter of weeks. and dont pretent to be an expert on them, but although I will take advise I will not accept that all that needs to be dscovered has been discovered.

The world is not flat!

thts a rather 18th century emperialistic perception.

The three main arguments against my test results were

1. So called quotes from Jdobbs
2. CCE manual
3. CCE thenselves.

All these have been shown to be wrong.

If you see providing evidance to the contry of detractors as egotism, then any debate or discussions would be futile.

If you already knew what CCE has to say RE:, Generally speaking, multi-pass has a bigger effect on lower average bitrate, as I had discovered, then why denie or argue it? or was your reference to somthing else from CCE.

And no I am not hell bent on pissing of an many people as I can as you well know from my PM MESSAGES.

I have contributed a test which has been vigerously disputed by most seniour memebers and then proven correct by the very sources quoted as evidance against.

There is no ego involved on my part

But considering you all spent your summer testing then there is nothing more to discover. you speek of EGO?

PS Please read. I said as many as three times before the 6 pass backup at low bit rates lower than 3 Mbit/s were the documentry disks (Much larger that the movies themselves) not the movies of LOTR, which can with the help of Nero recode, dvdRemake (Which I Own! as well) or Rockas software, be resized to as low as 5.4gig, and a 2 or 3 pass is sufficiant.

Your not reading my posts. Or not willing to explore an alternative point of view.

 

tijgert,

Unlike Nolos you actually had a problem to solve.
The disc you had a problem with, did you try with your CCE basic to see if it would complete the process.

I have found that using the same drive for the source and destination folder can help substantially.
Defraging the hard drive is also a very good idea. I have periodically had problems when the drive got fragmented.

I was also concerned about the unusual error message you reported. Was this word for word or an approximation so we would get an idea of the problem.
The possibility of a virus comes to mind. A scan never hurts.

I recommend 2 pass encoding until we can figure the problem out so not as much time is lost on unsuccessful attempts.

As you can, information about your machine and OS, and setup would be usefull to us.