Help with aspect ratio using TMPGEnc

Is it just me or is your message noy posting?

 

Yeah the DVD santa would be a good solution if it supported surround sound, you would have to sacrifice 6-channel for 2-channel stereo.

I already have mkvtoolkit, it's gltchy at best. downloaded it twice and still broken.

 

I take that back mkvtoolkit APPEARS to be working fine, but another problem with using dvd santa is that it doesn't sound like it supports multiple audio tracks. Also, the tutorial @ matroska.org only describes mkv toolkit being used to mux another mkv file.

Heres another option to consider, assume we succesfully find away to convert the mkv video into a m2v, avi, or whatever while keeping the picture quality/aspect ratio etc intact and we get the audio synced up.
Then, make one copy of the movie with the english audio track, make another copy of the movie with the japanese audio track. If need-be create hardsubs on the japanese version (although softsubs would still be prfered), and burn both movies to the dvd (selectable at a titlescreen), I think this may be a good way to go if all else fails, it would depend on the file size of the finished movie.I believe the movie itself is only about 50min long.
If this sounds feaseable(?) then it will be "Plan B"

Man it's freakin HOT! I dont know where your at but where I live its 100 degrees @ 12:00am and the AC broke today, must leave computer.

 

OK, got it converted to avi with VDM when I view the file it plays with the english audio stream, no matter what player I open it with WMPclassic or WinDVD it doesn't detect a second audio stream or subtitles, so I guess my next question is can you have multiple streams in an avi? should I convert/demux needed streams with VDM?

I also opened it with gspot here are the details:

SIZE: 1503mb
Is a valid AVI
---------------------------
Stream Type/AV interleave:
TYPE:Open DML AVI
IMRR: 1.00
I/L: 1 vid frame (40ms)Split: yes
---------------------------
Comments /Meta Data:
ISFT software VDM 1.5.10.2 build2540/release
JUNK ACSII(in junk chunk) VDM build2540
JUNK ACSII(in junk chunk) release
---------------------------
Video:
CODEC: xvid
RT:1hr 35min 48sec
AR:720x400 (1.80:1)[=9:5]
1928 kb/s
25 fps
Qf:0.268 bits/pixel
---------------------------
Audio:

(note: Stream 1 and 2 are highlighted/selectable with 3 greyed-out/inactive, stream 1 and two have identical properties)

0x0055(MP3) ID'd as MPEG-1 Layer 3
128 kb/s (64/ch, stereo) CBR
48000 Hz

 

Wow...you making progress. Let's look at theat GSPot:

25fps...you got yourself a PAL

the 720x400 framesize looks like consistent with your first report of 720x408.
Mp3 audio.

Are you sure you didn't change the framerate when you dubbed it in VDB? because it's now Looking like a PAL with (25fps) and the PAL needs 720x576 aspect ratio...the pixels in PAL are more square than the rectanglar ones in NTSC. The picture quality would be better if we kept it all PAL and we wouldn't have to do a framerate conversion..i.e. less of a problem with audio sync...converting All to NTSC. So you live in North America? I asked my son if he knew of Ghost in the Shell 2, won the Canne Film Fest? Best Anime...atleast I'll have someone to give the finished copy too. But, it needs to be in NTSC. When every I give friends PAL copies...they always have problems...most of the time just impatent while their DVD players set there Reading/thinking about PAL..I live in U.S. too.
Yes, DVD_SANTA has too many limitations..that's why I'm skipping down to the part of using the MKVtoolkit to extract what is needed(in this case...everything)

 

Yes, you could use a program called AVI_Mux to mux in additional audio streams to the AVI. But when we go to encode the AVI to MPEG-2
I'm not sure how the encoder will react. Or when we try to drop it into DVD_LAB Pro how smooth that would go either.. I think the best bet is to keep them all seperate and import the audio into DVD+LAB individually. Keep it simple. But you have time on your hands..and if you wanted a AVI with multi audio to play on PC. You could use the above program AVImux then use the progam Morgan Splitter in you pc...so you could select which audio to play within you PC player.

Right now, you have to ask yourself..do you want to make a PAL DVD or NTSC? Because it now looks like you have a PAL video source.

I don't know...those two copies from Pirate Bay..they are NTSC with DTS surround and Dolby...leave off the Polish subtitles, language might be better/easier to work with them?

 

No, the framerate was set to : DO NOT CHANGE (current frame rate 25.00fps). Basicly, the only thing I selected in vdm was direct audio stream, and then save as avi. It's safe to say this IS a pal since the only region this version of the dvd is available is region 2 (PAL). If it was available in region 1 ntsc I would have just bought the damn thing (curse you Dreamworks!). Oh yeah, I live in U.S. So as long as in the end I have a dvd that I can view on a standard ntsc dvd player/television without any stretching or scrunching to the picture, all is well. Keep in mind that in Adobe After Effects or premier it's VERY simple to convert a 25fps wav file into 29.97, 30, or 24fps I can do that in about 30 seconds. If you don't have Adobe AE we'll get you a copy and walk you through the process, I don't see it being a huge problem in the end. Although, I am going to end up scrapping the english stream from this .mkv and inserting a better version. My main concern now is getting the JAP stream into (hopefully) 6 channel ac3/pcm/wav so I'm going to start working on that now.

In the end I do want an NTSC DVD that I can watch with a stand-alone DVD player.

 

Sorry so long to get back..was shuttling between L.A. Vancover & Sidney.
1. Be careful around here about saying such thans as "we'll get you a copy of Program X" sounds like Piracy. And there's no Need I've had the Adobe Production Suite for sometime. The latest addition to it being Encore.

Hmmmm, using PPro to do a 2:3 pulldown. Honestly, I never really considered that! Usually, I use CCE then end up with a A/V sync problem cause I'm too lazy to use a Bitrate calculator or Conversion tables and input the right bitrate for the audio. You'd think the darn Encoder would do it automatic. So, when u use PPro for that does it process the audio too? elimanating the sync problem? While you're at it...you know you can use PPro to change the aspect ratio, too. Come to think of it...my ppro 1.5 has surcode Dolby AC3 5.1 encoder with it too...could transform any of those audio streams to 5.1 I'm just guessing but how do you do the framerate conversion with PPro...other than selecting those Project properties..importing the PAL .avi then Rendering? Please Post some screenshots if it's more InVOLVed. Also, which Mpeg Encoder you think is better quality wise...the built in with PPro or CCE...and if you already had PPro all the time...what were you doing with TMPGenc when you could have just done it ALL with PPro?

 

hmmm, don't think that is very practical use of NLE. I just ran a "trial" I imported a NTSC 7 minute 11000 frame music video into a PAL project to test the idea of using it to convert the framerate to 25fps. The good news is it works..the audio was perfectly in sync with the new video framerate....bad news...it took 15minutes to Render it and it was only a 7 minute video...this movie is 2hrs?
I'm using P4 at 2.8gig 2 gig RAM. That would mean about 4hrs to completely render-GhostinShell. Another consideration, this Music Video of mine is a 1.45 gig .AVI and the MainConcept built-in Mpeg encoder claims it would increas the size to 7 gig after converting...think of what a 1.5-2hr movie rendered with PPro 32-bit High Quality 3pass CBR would work out to!

 

Yeah, rendering a uncompressed AVI in Adobe Premiere or AE, is going to use huge amounts of disk space, thats why I was using converters. I don't have a lot of experience with Premiere, I was using AE for my editing needs until I recently got a new mainboard & re-installed AE but for some reason I have codec problems now, most AVI's cause errors (53::33) and cause it to crash, and that's when I learned of VDub (about a week ago) remember I am still a noob, all these programs (TMPGEnc, VDM ,gspot, Ifoedit, srt2sup, MKVtoolnix, AIMOne, DVDlab) I hadn't heard of 'till the date of my first post (about 4 days ago). Are you familiar with ulead media Studio? It did a good jb of outputting a high quality avi file while keeping the file size manageable. Then I discovered it had a built in batch converter, it looked promising until I went to convert and then it would fail for some unknown reason, but then I got sucked into the realm of batch converters. As far as converting the avi losslessly(?) this may be the way to go.
I dont think the audio in the mkv is ac3, gspot says it's mp3. Can a mp3 hold 6-channel audio? Do you have the mkv file yet?

Oh yeah.. another thing I was thinking, I usually burn my videos to dvd with Nero Vision Express, never before had I opened up the file to see what size/format the video was in, as long as the video was avi or mpeg they seemed to burn fine as far as picture/aspect ratio because nero was set to burn in NTSC format, I even opened GITS2 in Nero and previewed the dvd, no stretching. I might actually burn a test copy onto dvd-rw to see if this is true. Do you know if there is a DVD authoring program that accepts multi-audio & subs and burns using the same method as Nero Vison? does this make sense?

sorry if I'm running you around in circles here, it's just the combination of learning new stuff while trying to achieve the simplest solution. I have a VIDEO_TS of G.I.T.S.2 on the way hopefully its legit, finding a way to convert it to NTSC might be the best solution here.

some new links:
http://www.johnisme.com/avi.shtml
^^^haven't even read this one yet, just remembered I had it

http://forum.videohelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=221928

http://forum.videohelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=129419&highlight=

 

Just burned a test dvd using Nero Vision of the first 5 minuites of the GITS2 pal AVI file onto DVDRW, when I first went to burn Nero popped up a window asking if I wanted to burn the pal in ntsc format I selected yes, it burned and played well AR looks good, good quality, but it did skip every few minutes. My DVD Player does do that sometimes with DVD-RW's but I think this could also be because of the framerate discrepencies.?

 

I'm sticking with this "project" because it poses/offers something new..working with a .mkv....working with sub-titles + multilanguage.

But, there are many inconsistances about this whole thing.
(1) I googled "GhostintheShell:2" it's available to order from many different sites NTSC or PAL DVD from $15.99- 39.00.
(2) Japan is NTSC along with U.S. anything coming out of there is usually NTSC.
(3) PAL is better quality than NTSC, most new standalone players will Play a PAL DVD.
(4)Any PAL DVD can easily be Ripped, then there is Software which can "convert" the entire contents of the Video_TS to NTSC!

But there goes all the FUN!
Back to the "FUN"
No, don't have it finished downloading..got 50% done, still a day of active downloading to go.
Question?
Since I don't have it downloaded yet, When you play the .MKV in your PC does it have Menus...and buttons...to chose between subtitles, language, audio? Are you going to want to "SAVE" these? I'm not sure you can Import a "working" menu to DVD_LaB_Pro. Since I only use DVD_Lab_Pro to create DVD's from my own "home-grown" video, and .avi's downloaded(which don't come with Menu) I haven't tried this yet either. I know Encore had the options of importing as Menu,Timeline, or ASSET. But DVD_Lab_Pro only has asset or Movie.

Nero Vison:
I don't believe it supports multi-audio, subtitles. and the menu is a joke. But you could ask up in the Nero Forum if it does support these things.
DVD_Lab has it's own Burner, Priemere Pro has a burner. Encore has burner, Liquid has burner, TmpgEnc Dvd author has burner.
Welcome to the world of A/V where there's dozens of different tools/paths to make a DVD. Ask any two members of this forum "how" do you do this. And everyone has a different "method" and tool of choice...how many times I've heard ConvertXtoDVD..over and over. It's refreshing to have a "newbie' come in and join the club..and suggest "new" approaches..Many people just keep doing things 1 way..get stuck in a single "routine" because it works and won't try something new. Like using a NLE to do the framerate conversion...it did work! and didn't result in a sync problem probably better quality audio than when BeSweet gets finished. So we could use it to convert the audio stream only to the new framerate! Then mux it back in and see if it's in sync.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not abandoning the whole mkv thing, I'm seeing more and more of these files floating around particullarly among anime fans and some people say it has the potential to become the new standard
so might as well get a system down that works. Now having said that, When It comes to animation I am VERY particular about quality, being an Artist/Animator myself I understand the importance of viewing animation as close as possible to the way the artist intended it to be viewed. If there's a flaw I WILL notice it. Thats why usually I just buy Anime, which brings mt to - the frustration of buying Anime on DVD in America-

Now, Yes there is a U.S. release of this movie, distributed by Dreamworks. Problem- they absolutely butchered it, even the cover art is a disgrace. They didn't even attempt to get the english actors from the first movie or the TV series to do an english dub, the subs are a bright-yellow pixelated mess that display halfway up the screen, and forget about accurate translation, the plot is incoherent.

It's not easy to accurately translate japanese to english, there are many language as well as cultural hurdels to overcome and anime tends to deal with esoteric philosphical subject matter that can be hard to grasp in the first place. To get a good translation usually requires the writers of the original film getting together with the english writers, which means a distribution company has to be willing to put up a budget for that to happen. i.e.-not Dreamworks. Eventhough they're one of biggest distributors in America, big enough to halt any other worthy contender (Manga) from releasing it's version in the U.S. It's been two years and there's still no talk of a Manga N.American release.

Now Japan does use region 2 NTSC, and if there is a japanese version with English audio from a website that ships to the U.S. and takes American Express, I would be very interested (post a link). BUT, japanese version many times aren't japanese versions, they're Asian versions, meaning you might get the official (Manga) japanese release, or you might get the "sweatshop special" version ripped on a pc by some bootlegger in Singapore.

SOME dvd players will play PAL dvd's but I wouldn't count on it, unless you have a region free dvd player. Plus I want to have something I can watch anywhere without bringing my DVD player along with me. When I get the DVD i'm gonna try to convert to ntsc with the methods frim the links of my last post, but you know what they say, never put all your eggs in one basket.

Yes when I play the MKV in WMPC there are subtitle/language menu/buttons. This guide here says that the audio/subs will be selectable by dvd remote (not necessary but would be very cool)
http://www.videohelp.com/forum/userguides/169251.php
We won't be burning an avi well be creatind a vob from the avi or m2v + audio and subs then burning the vob, right?

That method uses IFOedit and there could be some subtitle issues with that, - wait till you get to that part (?)>:-(

Nero doesn't support subs or multi audio but the reason I was asking is becausr it does convert the PAL avi into NTSC if other dvd burners work the same way then the video is ready to go. I'm trying to get all the elements of the DVD into workable formats that sync with eachother, I need to know what format the video needs to be in and I need to know if the MP3 in the mkv is 6 channel audio (5.1), then I can continue moving forward.

 

I wouldn't count on the quality of that conversion from pal to ntsc...the audio will be out of sync and the pulldown would probably be terrible. Other authoring tools which go from AVI->DVD without using a MPEG encoder in Middle & has multi audio & subs? Answer: Adobe Encore( if you also have PPro) installed too..don't you love "shared resources".
As for the guide you supplied: it's for DVD_LAB/ I have DVD_LaB_Pro:
bigger, more bells,balls&whistles; my point to asking about the menus was this: There isn't a need to use IFOEdit with DVD_LAB_PR0 you can have multi-audio and subs with menus because Pro allows for the use of VMG menu.....but You have to create these Menus FROM SCRATCH...I don't believe it allows for Importing the working menus found in the MKV. I could be wrong about this. Encore I believe does allow for the import of a "working Menu" Now, keep in mind you will need one of these Authoring programs...and the trial versions LEAVE WATERMARKS...flashing messages across the screen, etc or basically don't allow you to burn, save, etc. at all. Enough said..read between the lines. So do you have any good .jpg's from the Movie to use as Menu Backgrounds? The theme song saved as a seperate audio file to import to Menu Studio?

The mp3 audio is 2-channel Stero...you'll need to convert it to AC3 or find a "surround" format to import into the DVD author. The video must be 720x480 either 16:9 or 4:3<<if using DVD_LaB+-Pro..it needs to be .mpg 29.97fps(you must pulldown)b4 importing to DVDauthor. Basically, the PAL you currently have is either a PAL 720x576 that's been molested and cut down to 720x408, maybe a 4:3 that's been converted to 16:9 by placing the black bars top&bottom/ or it was orig NTSC 720x480 "custom aspect ratio/i.e. fixed" then had frame rate converted to PAL. Anyway, it's already been scrunched/clipped. Are you sure you searched all the Torrents and checked all the available file descriptions for a 720x480 or a 720x576 16:9 . It would be better to be working with a Virgin video framesize. We can't add back what's been cut away/masked over.

 

Question: is there a way to use an avi like you would use an mpeg2/m2v i.e. have the avi be the video stream while thde DVD simultaneously plays the audio stream or do avi files always include audio even if its dead air?

My bad, I misunderstood the question. No, the MKV does not have a menu w/ buttons, it just plays the movie then you can choos audio/subs from the player's option menu. I don't care if the DVD has a menu or not, I kind of like the barebones approach to my dvd's just put them in and play (no menu's) that's why I liked the idea of being able to selest the audio/subs my remote. but yes, I believe I do have good jpegs to use if a menu is needed (nero's menu template DOES suck big time.) If not then I will when the hard copy gets here (scan in the cover, use the original cover art.) as for theme songs my opinion on that is f_it
it's just hype to me, the meat and bones is the movie itself, but there is a OST for this movie (great soundtrack too) that's actually easier to find than the movie itself.

I have 4 other copies of this movie (two VIDEO_TS [direct dvd copy], two avi [ac3 5.1 by the way]) plus a hard copy from the UK on the way, plus the mkv, if you want to search for another mkv in ntsc (highly unlikely you'll find one) be my guest, post a link.

 

I have a full working version of DVD Lab Pro v1.53

 

Well, been reading up on the SubTitle Part of this project. The multi-audio is a piece of cake with Pro. There's no need for IFOEdit there... but will need it for the subtitles(I think)In fact, after going over it all...I get the feeling We're about to get BUT_F_CK_D with an Elephant D_cK! And I don't even Read Japanesse...but as long as we're getting SCR_W_D I think I'll throw in those Polish Subs TOO.

Ok, again you ask a crazy question. Forget about .AVI you can't keep that format and have a DVD.
STEP 1.
You got everything extracted from the .mkv using MkvExtract & VDM and you got all those seperate files collected in a Project folder.

Start encoding:
You need a MPEG-2 file. Use the TMPGenc if you don't have CCE.
Project wizard page(1/5) DVD NTSC(16:9) In the audio window CBR MPEG-1 LayerII(MP2) audio/ page 2: supply the path to the .avi Under Expert settings for Source: Interlaced Bottom Field first (find out if it's 4:3 or 16:9) PAL then in Content of Video: Video
Page 3: Other settings(the advanced settings) Video Size: Change this to 720x480, Aspect ratio: change to 16:9 Framerate: 29.97
Under ADVANCED TaB: Video Arrange Method (Center(custom size) then enter the desired 720x480 BE sure to check 3:2 pulldown At the bottom where it says STREAM type Select System(audio+Video)

AFTER encoding; play the .mpg in media play check for audio/video sync. Then check the properties either with GSPOT or PPro(under File->get properties->file Check to see if you have a proper 720x480 16:9 29.97fps .mpg

Then; DEMUX with TMPGenc tools
take the resulting .mp2 audio file insert into a "dummy" PPro Project. Select File->Export->Adobe Media Encoder Check the setting for Audio Only...Under Audio Format select Dolby...then click on Options..that will bring up the SurCode Advanced 5.1 surround sound options ...when you have your AC3 settings the way you want click OK....and soon you have a AC3 audio stream. Otherwise, buy the TMPGenc AC3 encoder install with DVD_LAB_Pro and Transcode the .mp2 file from there

 

OK, so basicly were back to where we were at the beginning of the thread - Trying to use tmpgenc to convert to m2v without distorting the aspect ratio.
I'll try those settings you provided,if this would be easier with ccce, please post settings or a brief tutorial and I'll use that instead. What is the full name of CCCE?

I'm not going to use the audio in the mkv because it is mp3 which, from the info i've been able to find, can only be 2-channel. You would blow my freakin' mind if you could find a way to take a stereo audio file and convert it to TRUE 5.1 surround sound, the information to send which signals to which channels/speakers couldn't possibly be contained in a file format that only supports stereo sound, not in the exact same way the original 5.1 surround did, could it!? Forget lossless, that reverse degredation!

once I get a real 5.1 audio file it can easily be demuxed in VDM. (remember re-naming the wav to ac3, but it has to be a 5.1 file or you just have a stereo audio file in ac3 format.)

 

:scratches head: once again you've re-ordered your Pizza..now you say..Menu not needed/wanted...this is the whole point of using a top of the line DVD_Authoring program like DVD_LaB_PR0..the ability of have EVERYTHING..just like a store bought DVD and that means Menu.
If you don't like menu.and prefer BAREBones...then how about this idea..You could use Mux a single audio stream to a .mpg or use AVI_Mux or someother program...then Use Nero Vision to make a single audio DVD, just go back and make 2 or 3 seperate DVD's each with the different Audio.. or put 3 copies of the same Movie each with a different audio stream....create a simple Menu...compress this to a DVD-5.

Back to the beginning Yes...it's the middle of the road actually...all DVD .vob's are MPEG-2 video. EVEN when you use Nero and import a .avi to make a DVD...you're still encoding the .avi to mpeg-2 It's just Nero does it (poorly..sorry..the truth hurts..but you get what you pay for)for you Internally in one step.

Creating a MPEG without distorting the aspect ratio? Again I beleive you're missing the point....the video you obtained has already undergone plenty of distorting...it was ripped from a DVD, converted(compressed) to Mpeg-4 divx...Packed in a .mkv...uploaded to the WWW...downloaded..unpacked..

 

re-ordering my pizza?..remember when I said this:

My original point in using a dvd authoring program is to have softsubs and selectable audio tracks, plus I was just following a tutorial bacause I've never used a DVD authoring program besides NERO, right now I'm just trying to find a way to get it to dvd at all, a menu can be added whenever you or I need/want it.

BTW, the final dvd is going to be a DVD-5 for me, I don't have DVD9's and even when I look for them @ Fry's or Comp USA (which have the biggest selection where I live) they don't have them. Maybe I can by some online if I have to.

Yes but it's still the best version floating around on the web, other than the actual VOB's. All the avi's are 700mb fuzzy blobs and when I say distorted I mean the picture itself- you can physically see with your eye the difference between a perfect circle, or an oblong- or a square and a rectangle. or a guy who has a normal shaped head and a guy with an alien shaped head. Do you see what I'm saying? The original mkv video is proportionate when viewing the actual video.

Normal:




Distorted:




TMPGEnc stretches the original video when converting to ntsc hence the title of this thread.