Neph's POLITE Gun Debate

I picked up a nice used Browning A5 Magnum Twelve today while down at the local pawn. I don't know if I came out ahead or not (not really, lol). I traded 2 for 1. 1 of the trade guns I bought for $160 (from the same shop) and the other I'd invested about $325. Sounds like I came out ahead. Problem is, I do professional grade gun restorations. So, what I paid wasn't the true value of the guns. A lot of painstaking work went into refurbishing them. The bluing is nearly perfect on the trade guns, and the wood (walnut with good grain and highlights) now have hand rubbed oil finishes. Both have good actions and lock up tight. During the process the guns were completely disassembled, all parts inpected, thoroughly cleaned, and reassembled along with the restored pieces. Those old guns turned out to be beauties and a pleasure to shoot. The $160 gun was a favor from the pawn dealer, I think. It was one of my project guns for improving my craft skills. He didn't mind letting it go, but was glad to see it back. LOL I'm anticipating the finished A5 when I get through with restoration.

I was just thinking in print and bragging on my new acquisition. Both the pawn dealer and I are happy with the deal. He can sell the guns I traded for more than the A5. As for myself, once I finish, the A5 will be worth more than my investment in the trade guns. I like trades like that where both sides come out ahead. You don't usually see many of those. LOL

Abuzar
I regret to hear you got ripped on your purchase. Wasn't your father there to protect your interests?

Since you have it, you may as well do some minor improvements (finances permitting). First, you should have a qualified gunsmith inspect the gun (if it wasn't new). Then make sure it shoots a decent pattern. You don't want to put money in a gun with a dodgy barrel that spreads a wide pattern. You can have a trigger job done on the rifle that should improve accuracy. The SKS is a cheap military gun not known for smooth trigger actions. There's plenty of inexpensive aftermarket stocks and accessories for the SKS (from sporting to slick paramilitary, even saw one that makes the SKS look like a Dragunov sniper rifle). If the SKS shoots straight, it should be worth fixing up a bit.

 

My dad doesn't know anything about guns lol. I have had so many things come up that I haven't even GONE to the shooting range.

The thing with the SKS was that the Barrel was covered when I bought it. I was retarded and I didn't check it. Turns out it was gun off alone with the Bayonet and the sights were gone. It's about 16 1/2 inches so I'm good in that regard.

I recently bought some stripper clips, a scope mount and a scope for this rifle. Let's hope it shoots straight. I bought it for 200

 

I posted this in the funnies thread, and felt y'all may enjoy this one here too!!


Top 10 Reasons Why Handguns Are Better Than Women

10.) You can trade an old .44 for two new .22's.

9.) You can take one handgun on the road and keep another one at home.

8.) If you admire another man's gun and tell him so, he'll let you try it out a few times.

7.) Your primary gun doesn't mind if you have a back-up.

6.) Your handgun will stay with you even if you're out of ammo.

5.) A handgun doesn't take up alot of closet space.

4.) Handguns function normally every day of the month.

3.) A handgun doesn't ask..."Do these new grips make me look fat?"

2.) A handgun doesn't mind if you go to sleep after using it.

1.) You can buy a silencer for a handgun!

 

I have a question concerning an air rifle, technically it's not a gun but I thought I would post here instead of starting a new thread.

I recently inherited a Diana model 34 air rifle from my grandfather and I was wondering if anyone had advice on care and maintenance. The gun was purchased in the late 80's early 90's and basically sat in the box until now.

I'm amazed at the amount of power this thing has for an air gun, it actually has some kick to it. The rifle functions properly, I bought a scope and sighted it and it's amazingly accurate so there aren’t any mechanical problems. My main concern is the bluing on the metal, every time I touch the any of the metal I leave a finger print that will not come off. I read online that some easy DIY remedies include using a soft rag and wd-40 or motor oil that just doesn't seem right to me.

I would really appreciate some advice on how to properly condition the metal, brands of gun oil, methods, ect... I'm also planning on storing it for the winter and was wondering if leaving it slightly leaning against a wall could possibly throw the barrel alignment out of whack (kind of like a pool stick).

-any advice would be greatly appreciated

 

Any labeled gun oil would be better than motor oil or WD-40.
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.c... ACC.&dept2=CLEANING SUPPLIES&dept3=CHEMICALS

If you plan to store it for the winter, purchase a relatively cheap case to protect your airgun. A simple sleeve can be had for around $5 and should be fine it the item is oiled properly. Leaving it leaning against the wall can sometimes form rust where the barrel contacts the wall among other reasons that it is not a good idea.
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.c...N CARE & ACC.&dept2=CASES&dept3=RIFLE/SHOTGUN

 

Thanks for the info; I didn't know that cases could be found so cheap.
My main concern is that if I use the wrong kind of gun oil that I'll ruin the protective bluing making it more susceptible to rust. Should I buy a brand that is advertised for use specifically on blued metal or is that just some sort of gimmick (Paying for a brand name that isn’t any better in terms of quality).

 

@redux79

I have one of the older Diana air pistols that I got from a friend several years back. The company still manufactures high quality airguns. I hope you bought an airgun scope and not a regular one for guns using gunpowder. The way an airgun recoils can damage a regular rifle scope over a period of time (depends on usage of course).

Remington gun oil is a good brand. You can get it in spray and bottle form. There's other good brands, Rem Oil is simply good and found at Wal Mart (making it easy to find). The bottled oil is easier to apply with swabs and the spray easier to cover larger areas. Gun oil is better for a gun than WD40. Without getting into the why(s), lets just say the specialized oils do a better job of lubricating and protecting the metal. A good gun cloth treated with silicone is good for rubbing off fingerprints before storing a gun of any type. I like the Hoppes brand, but there's other good ones. Hoppes also sells a decent oil. The main thought is silicone impregnated gun cloth. You should be able to find an airgun cleaning kit with rod, brush, and swab. A high quaility airgun should be treated much like a regular powder gun. Take care of the gun and you should be able to hand it down someday. These guns are usually too powerful for young children, unless there is direct adult supervision.

Be careful of what you use when cleaning. Some of the spray cleaners (like Gun Scrubber) can damage plastic, rubber, and fiber components.

I keep my long guns stored in silicone treated gun sacks. Again, Remington seems to be Wal Mart's brand and the one I prefer, good quality and price, and readily available. They're cheaper than the sleeves, normally less than $10. The sack helps protect the gun while in storage. I keep the sack on guns and put them in a carry case or gun sleeve when I head to the field. Your gun should be kept in a dry area. I keep my guns in a safe with a desiccant to absorb moisture. It doesn't hurt to have the gun lean against something, as long as the surface of the gun is being protected. I cringe when I see guns sitting out in racks above the fireplace. Those glass gun cases aren't much better unless they have one of the drier units. Put the gun in a gun sock and store it in the corner of a dry closet. Laying guns under beds isn't a good idea unless the carpet is dry all the time. I've seen guns put under beds and come out rusty because of moisture that gathers in cool dark places. If you do happen to see a tiny rust spot develop on the bluing, you can clean the area with alcohol and buff with 0000 steel wool (no rough stuff). Then put the oil back on it to protect the surface.

The Diana should be rigid enough that you won't get the pool cue effect when standing it up. Most guns stay in a rack of some sort. If propping them up was a problem, then they would sag in a wall rack. Good luck.

 

Thanks for the heads up on the silicone treated cloths and gun sleeves. I've been looking online at cases and cleaning kits, the prices were a little steep to say the least not to mention shipping. I'll check wallmart later today and see if I can't find what I'm looking for.

I made sure when buying my scope that it was meant to withstand recoil. I'm still amazed at the amount of power this air rifle has, I ended up having to use a 1 1/2 inch pine board to hang my targets on. After a dozen or so shots I checked the back out of curiosity and a couple of the pellets actually made it through.

 

Good airgun scopes are made for the type of recoil created by an airgun. It's different from a powder gun. Just one of the peculiarities of the beast. Unless you do a lot of shooting, you shouldn't notice the difference though. I said gun sack, not sleeve, they're different. A sleeve is heavier than a gun sack and the Remington sacks are treated with silicone to help protect the gun. I think the sacks are about 7 or 8 dollars. Most of the supplies mentioned are relatively inexpensive at Wally's.

 

Pacman has given you some excellent advice, One word of caution though, be wary of using WD-40 inside your trigger group or on any internal mechanism, the reasin why, over time the lubricant will evaporate and leave behind a gooey mess of Gunk. I've used it on the outside of a barrel to keep the rust off, and used Marvel Mystery Oil as an internal lubricant. Take good care of your weapon and it will last you a life time. For air rifples make sure you pay attention to the inner seals and follow the manufacturer's instructions on keeping them lubricated and fresh. My dad sold my pellet gun a couple of years ago for over $100.00 and the guy was amazed that after 30 years the rifle would still pump up and shoot as if it was new.

 

I agree. WD for rusty bolts and gun oil for guns. A person could write an article on proper gun care.

 

First off thank you everyone for your help and advice, I'm sorry it's taken me so long to reply I've been really busy lately. The first walmart I stopped at had a spotting goods section that consisted of two small isles with mostly fishing supply's and paint ball accessories. I then checked the larger walmart that I knew had a decent size sporting goods section and found most of what I needed.

I bought a silicon treated gun sack and some Remington gun oil (they only carried the spray kind). They only had shotgun cleaning kits so I'm going to have to order the kit online. I took the scope and trigger guard off and managed to remove most of the small rust spots that had accumulated (I really should have done this when I first took the rifle out of the box). There are a few rough spots where the rust doesn't want to budge; I think the oil should prevent it from spreading or getting worse.

Again thank you for all the help and advice, I think I’ll get the nerve up to try and remove the small rust spots once I know more about proper gun care.

 

Extremly fine grade steel wool soaked in gun oil has worked for me in removing small rust spots, but be careful of excessive buffing, the blueing may come off as well.
Edited for poor spelling.

 

Blivet is right in using care with the steel wool. Oil gives a polishing effect, using it dry gives a bit more bite. I use the 0000, Super Fine grade for polishing blued surfaces. With Super Fine steel wool you're not going to scratch, even when using dry. I use it dry to blend and polish the finish on reblued guns. 0000 also works well with removing small areas of light rust speckling. Rust means the bluing has been compromised. Don't be too surprised if you get shiny spots where the speckling is when you do the cleanup. If the rust has gone deeper, you'll need to go to a rougher grade of steel wool or even sandpaper, the grade depending on how deep the rust pits are.

Wal Mart appears to have dropped cold gun blue from their line. I've not found it in any of the stores in my region for the past month or so. If you have a gunsmith shop nearby, you could check there. I mention cold bluing because it is a good way to touch up a blued gun. It comes in different formulas, from a grayish black to black and a light blue to a deep Belgium blue. Brownell's has a good selection of several brands with different finish characteristics. They also have a service section where you can get advice. After a while you get a feel for matching and blending when refurbishing guns. For a beginner it can seem daunting (The directions on the bottle don't always yield the best results). If the job starts getting out of hand, seek the services of a professional or someone that has been doing this type work for a while. Check pricing. You may want to live with a little "do it yourself" discoloration over the cost of professional repairs.

 

Calling the wise old marksmen or hotshots to come and tell me about some guns, looking to mod FO3 weapons but having trouble figuring out where to start some stats and history on some of the guns would help me find some direction and be a good conversation as well.

http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/721253

 

I am neither a hotshot nor an old marksman, just been around guns for a while.

I'll give you a link which should keep you busy for a few hours.
http://world.guns.ru/main-e.htm

Choice of firearms can be set by organization standards, such as military and law enforcement. Civilians are where the big differences in opinions come in. Take for instance a sniper rifle. If you want to kill a tank, use a 50 caliber; smaller targets usually call for something like the 308 (close to 7.62 NATO, headspace spec slightly different, though 308 and 7.62 can be interchanged if specs are close enough). 308 is a favored caliber by the US military and law enforcement for sniper rifles. The Remington 700 has long been a favored gun in those circles. The Russian Dragunov and Walther sniper rifles are a also fine weapons. I'll say it again, choose the right weapon for the job and the circumstances. For instance, a long range shooter might opt for a 300 magnum over the 308.

Handguns, up close and personal, it's hard to beat a 45 auto. High velocity rounds have a tendency to bore through before expanding. Check into gel tests, if you can find them. 10mm pistols may sound romantic but it's little brother the S&W 40 is a much more useful and common caliber. The 40 is a cut down 10mm. A hot round with less recoil and does less damage over time to the frame. I can vouch for the caliber, I own an HK USP in 40. HK makes a full line of firearms, some with tactical setups with the barrels already threaded. Most of the big firearms makers supply good firearms for police and military use. Some have online sites (just Google). I own and have owned Berettas, Smiths, Colts, Remingtons, HKs, Winchesters, Rugers, Mausers, Walthers (and others I've forgotten), and have found most to be good guns with need for only a few improvements (usually just polishing a rough edge). Of course I've owned a few stinkers. Some were simply cheaper guns built with looser tolerances. Often you get what you pay for.

Revolvers... sure dependability and sometimes heavier firepower, but outguned by the auto's capacity. I've got an 8 shot 357 wheel gun, but you don't see many of those. Mine is an expensive custom set up for comptetion shooting. I think Taurus has one at a reasonable price (without the honed action of course). If you want to see heavy caliber handguns, visit the Smith and Wesson site. They've got a big fifty, but there's some slightly smaller rounds that deliver better velocities. Put a stock on some and you'd have a nice little rifle. For the uninitiated, many high velocity rounds go a long distance, but have less knockdown when they reach the target. Though a 17 HMR will do a job on a prairie dog, it isn't considered a good military caliber. Larger calibers have the knockdown, but over longer ranges their trajectory has a much greater curve. You can make a larger caliber bullet go faster with more powder, but then you get into heavier recoil. Caliber, bullet weight, and load determine velocity, range, and trajectory. You need to keep that in mind for both handguns and rifles.

The main factor in being a good marksman is the shooter himself. This is where all the variables for a shot are processed. Then a high quality firearm and ammo come into play. You can't keep the rounds in a tight pattern if you don't have a well machined bore with tight tolerances. Most cheap guns need not apply. Occasionally you'll come across an exceptionally accurate gun from the bargain bin, but it's more a rarity than the rule. When someone says he has an old beater that shoots rings around the top guns, have him prove it. Trigger mechanism and furniture also come into play. The ammo has to be good quality. Bullets that vary in weight, along with inconsistent powder charge, can effect how tight the pattern will be.

I've heard 22s are dangerous and can see why. Frying pans in the wrong hands are also deadly. LOL Don't forget the link at the beginning of my reply. LOL That's where the real info is.

 

LOL
you are a hot shot(for going overboard/TMI )
I have 5 or 8 real world based weapons to tweak to be alil closer to real world efficiency, I just want to confrim the weapons base in reality and then see what I can do to make it closer to the real world variant.

You see the FO world is a futuristic world based on how it is seen from the 30-50s however they seem to skip some ammo to weapon specs and go to a more generalized version, instead of using 7.XX ammo for the assault weapons they go for a very modern nato round, and a muaser c96 variant using 10MM rounds.

 

From what I've seen, some of the fictional guns in FO3 can't exist in the real world. Why worry about calibers, cyclic rates, chamber pressures, and spring and gas recoil systems? Use the max specs allowed in the game and hope your fictional hero can carry the load.

If you want to talk real guns, ask some specific questions and someone will probably answer your question. There's a few old timey marksmen around. I'm sure Creaky knows a lot about long range shooting and what makes the bullet go bang and the prairie dog fall down.

Good luck with the game. Beware, they can become addictive. LOL