The (new) Official PC building thread!

Hmm... ok maybe 1 GTS is enough. I don't think the monitor i'm gonna get will be that big... but what if i end up getting to connect my PC to a TV? oh lol.

Still, if games will run sleek in 1024x768 (which is the maximum resolution of my notebook) it'll be fine.

 

There's nothing now, or in the near future I wager, that an 8800GTS can't handle at 1024x768. At that resolution, even my card can run every game at max.

 

Has anyone used these fans...Impressive specs...
http://www.svc.com/silenx-brand.html

120x38mm Standard
SilenX IXP-76-18 Ixtrema Pro 120mm x 38mm 18dBA 90CFM Fan Sale Price $23.95
SilenX IXP-76-14 Ixtrema Pro 120mm x 38mm 14dBA 72CFM Fan Sale Price $24.95

Or these

120x25mm Standard
SilenX IXP-74-11 Ixtrema Pro 120mm x 25mm 11dBA 46CFM Fan Sale Price $23.95
SilenX IXP-74-14 Ixtrema Pro 120mm x 25mm 14dBA 72CFM Fan Sale Price $22.95

 

LP531,

I haven't used them but I have read that they are not very honest about how much noise they make! Several members here and on another forum I belong to advised me against them! It's the main reason I tried the Silverstone FM-121 instead! Running the FM-121 at 1400 rpm moves about 70 cfm of air and is very quiet doing it. It has a maximum at 2500 rpm of 110 cfm, but very noisy at that speed. They are also cheaper than the Silenex, have their own speed control and have gotten a bit quieter with use. They are dual ball bearing and take a bit of working in to get the bearings seated properly. I now have that one and an FM-83 80mm side fan, blowing out at 1300 rpm. Fast enough to move about 27.5 cfm. Between the 100 or so cfm of the two Silverstones, plus the air flow of the power supply, balanced against the lower cfm of the front case fan allows the air vents in the case to draw lots of air, keeping the video card cool and with the 80mm pulling hot air off of the top of my Freezer 7 Pro, I get extremely cool temperatures for both the CPU and the MB! If you have a side vent in your case in front of the video card, you can't go wrong with this pair. Much quieter than the Thermaltake Thunderblade I tried in the old case! The supplied controllers keep the rpms nice and steady and the electronics are built into the fan so that all there is to the control is a tiny potentiometer.

Most of the complaints I've read about the Silenex fans has been to do with them wearing out fast. Not surprising considering their "Fluid Dynamic Bearings", or more correctly bushings. Not surprising as friction of the turning shaft generates heat which liberates the lubricant out of the "bushing" to the shaft where it lubricates the motor. I prefer the longer life span of dual ball bearings, and the lack of surge you can only get with dual ball bearing motors.

Here's a link to my posted temps.
http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/18/81431
I'm running an E4300 at 3.2GHz with GSkill Cas 4 DDR2800 memory overclocked to 890MHz. My video card is an XFX 7600GT overclocked from 570/1450 to 650 core and 1600 memory. My encode temps with DVDRB/CCE are in the mid 40s!

Clock On,
theone :>}

 

The specs are impressive, but they're wrong, so who cares?
If you're after a good airflow to noise ratio, the Scythe S-Flex fans seem to be the ones to go with. Assuming you have a steel case, most fans will do, but in lightweight or cheap cases, you'll need something that doesn't vibrate much, and the Silverstones aren't so good there.

 

sammorris,

I don't often outright disagree with someone but the Silverstones move more air at 1400 rpm than the S-Flex do at their maximum of 1600, by almost 10 cfm. At maximum speed the S-Flex is rated at 28 dBA, and it is not ball bearing! I don't know why you got vibrations with the "Stones", but I've been living with mine for several months now and there is no vibration at the speeds I'm running them at, and are extremely quiet below 1600 rpm. Even then you have to up them past 2000 rpm before noise becomes any sort of an issue! Both can be a bit noisy at top rpms, true, but there should never be a need to run them that fast, as mine combined pull about 100cfm of air at my present running speeds. I just installed a pair, the same as mine in the D-940 and it's so much quieter than the Thermaltake Thunderblade the 120 replaced!. Same speeds I'm running on mine keeps the CPU at 34-36C and the MB at 41-43C and the computer is much quieter. The CPU fan dropped about 300 rpm too!

From an engineering standpoint, the Silverstones are the better design! Dual ball bearings assure a longer life and do not cause surge as they get old like Fluid Dynamic, ceramic or any other fancy name for bushings with lubricant baked into them do. They are quieter at the same 1600 rpm than the S-flex and move a lot more air in the process! At 1400 rpm they still move more air and are damn near silent! I sit with my right ear less than 3' away from the 80mm fans outlet and it's not the least bit loud or annoying! I didn't even use the silicone grommets to install them as they are bolted firmly right through the case and side cover with standard fan screws! They do an excellent job of removing the heat from my computer case, and I highly recommend them to anyone looking to do a good job of cooling, without a lot of noise!

Clock On,
theone :>)

 

From what I hear, and what seems to make sense to me, is that the thin-bladed Silverstones with 9-blades will push less air at a given speed than the S-Flexes at 7-blades, but give a higher pressure, so they're more suited to heatsinks, radiators, etc.
Have you measured an S-Flex's airflow?
On a tangible scale, it seems to me like the Scythes are better at the same speed, I certainly think they're quieter, and have a lower-pitched noise which helps too. (187Hz at 1600rpm versus the Silverstone's 240Hz). Admittedly, if you don't have or want to use your own fan controller, the FM121s are better since they come with one and the Scythes don't, but the only fans I ever see used in silentPCs these days are Nexus, Yate Loon, Scythe and Papst. You don't see silverstones anywhere, and I honestly think that is why. Besides, in order for the silverstones to be inaudible, whether holding them in my hand or in the case, I have to use my own fan controller to drop the speed all the way down to 500rpm, where they're all but pointless. The Scythes disappear at around 800 for me.

 

Sam,
I hear what you are saying and I understand your point of view. I can't agree with you the on the noise level for cfm ratio. At 1400 rpm the Stones move 72-73 cfm. At roughly 10 cfm less, the S-Flex makes 28.0 dBA at 1600 rpm. In fact the noise increases sharply from 1200 up to maximum speed. That's an increase of a hair under 8dBA in only 400 rpm! That's an alarming rate of increase for such a small amount of rpm increase. Add to that at 800 rpm they don't move a hell of a lot of air (33 cfm) but they are quieter than the Stones! Problem is that even at that speed the noise doesn't matter much as 8.7dBA is below the ambient threshold so you can't really hear it anyway until you rise above 22 dBA or so, and that's only in a very quiet room! 25 or 26 dBA would be a more reasonable figure for a typical room!

I've found that my CPU cooler does a great job of cooling the CPU. The biggest problem is getting that hot air out of the case before it can build up anywhere else. With fans in the 33 cfm range, there just isn't enough airflow to do the job well, at least with a case design like mine! Since there are a lot of cases with the same type of fan layout and venting design as mine, anybody with that type would benefit more from the Silverstones than they would with the S-Flex.

Both my Silverstones have gotten quieter since they were installed. This happens with any ball bearing fan as the bearings and races get bedded in so they run quieter. Sort of like a final polish. I can hear airflow! If I strain I can hear something else, but I'm not quite sure what. I think it's the video card fan as it runs at top speed all the time because of the overclock. The variations in fan speed are so slight (10-15 rpm) that the frequency is always the same. Even when the CPU fan kicks up near top speed, the noise level is still quiet enough to hear the vid card fan! In fact, it's the only motor sound you hear at all. If you cover the air vent, all you hear is air moving. It's gotten so quiet that you can't really hear anything across a 12' room! You would certainly not know it was running judging by noise!

As you well know, I don't like any sort of sleeve bearing fans because of the compromises that have to be built into the design. Anything that depends on friction to release lubricant is flawed in it's design! You have to make the tolerances tight enough to accomplish that, yet try to eliminate stiction, which is an inherent problem with all sleeve bearing motors. It's a never ending process as the lubricant wears out and the friction slows down the motor until more lubricant is released which speeds up the motor. It doesn't take a lot of imagination to figure out that the more sleeve bearing fans you have in a computer, the more harmonics come into play! That's why some fans make more surge noise than others. You just can't get them to run at a near constant speed! I haven't touched my fan speeds in quite a while, but I know if I look right now it will be running at 1425 rpm, give or take about 7 rpm either way! OK, I cheated and looked! It's at 1427 rpm, as I knew it would be. I set it to 1425 about a month and a half ago. You just can't get that from a sleeve bearing motor! Not for long, anyway! Ironicly I see Scythe claims some outrageous MTBF on their fans of 150,000 hours. Maybe in a lab under controlled conditions, but not in the real world in a case fan. That's typical of the BS that Sony puts out,as they supply the bearings! They are used in some hard drives and last that long. Hey, they're sealed against dust and moisture. A fan runs in the air around it along with all the dust and dirt and anything else that's in the air. I frankly doubt that it would last 20,000 hours where I live as I've yet to have a sleeve bearing fan last anywhere near that long here, typically a year or less! What drives me nuts is the constant up and down of the rpms after a few months. I especially love the squealing noises they make when you fire up the computer cold, once they've started making noises! You can shoot a little WD-40 in them for a temporary fix, but it's new fan time, for sure! You can get used to and accept a constant quiet sound, but it's hard to get used to constant changes in noise and frequency, and frankly, it's annoying as hell!

Clock On,
Russ :>)

 

Here's a decent price on an HD 2600XT. Not a great gamer but an outstanding media player. Still, $119!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...2102&CMP=EMC-IGNEFL082107&ATT=N82E16814102102

Check it out!

Clock On,
theonejrs

 

I'm was thinking of pulling the trigger on that card...I was looking at the MSI as well...the MSI has silent cooling...I was going to use it for a media server...

 

But Russ, you don't own a Scythe fan do you? Manufacturer's ratings vary wildly, as you know from Thermaltake, so you have to take them with a pinch of salt. In fact, all fans speed ratings increase massively from 1200rpm to 1600rpm. The silverstones at 1200 I'd say are around 26dB, and at 1600 are around 33, because they are a similar volume to my Freezer 7 Pro just below full speed.
As far as I was aware, the S-FDB design was not sleeve bearing, it's fluid dynamic, which although similar, is not identical. Note that Samsung and Maxtor hard drives use FDBs, and they don't exhibit the symptoms sleeve bearing fans do.

On the HD2600, that range of cards does seem to have been quite cheap. Fortunate really, given the performance increase, or lack of.

 

I know the HD2600XT cards are not for gaming...just want something for a HTCP case...and HD playback...
The Zalman case that I am looking at has a 7" touchscreen that needs an ATI card for proper resolution display...
I have just about everything else to put it together just lying around...I need to do something productive with it all...
DFI CFX3200-DR/G M/B
2GB of Corsair PC-3200
3800 San Diego
OCZ 700Gamestream
80Gb Sata Drive for OS
All I would need is a couple Storage Drives...Case...and Video Card...maybe a Capture Card...so I could use it as a DVR...to burn from...Should be a nice little Media Center...

 

sammorris,

No matter what you call it, it's still a sleeve and still works by the same principals. In a hard drive, it's all sealed up no dust or anything gets in. A fan is out in the open and has to deal with all the dust an dirt in the air!

You are not even close with your guesstimates. There isn't even a noticeable noise difference between 1200 and 1600. I didn't lower the case fan to 1400 because of noise, I lowered it because it wasn't any cooler at 1600 rpm than it is at 1400! It's much quieter than you give it credit for. While you can hear a slight increase in noise above 1600, it only starts to get loud above 2000 rpm. The speeds I run them at, they are almost silent. 33dBA is a lot of noise and it's no where near that loud! You would have to spin them a lot faster than 1600 rpm to get 33 dBA. The loudest thing in my computer is still the video card fan. You can hear that over everything else in the computer, including the CPU fan at it's highest speed. If an aluminum case makes that much difference in noise, I don't want one! My 32" ceiling fan makes more noise than my computer, and that's just the noise of the air as there's very little mechanical sound at all! If I leave the computer on all night, it's barely noticeable in a dead quiet room! It made a lot more noise with the stock Cooler Master fan!

Clock On,
theone :>}

 

Favouritism on Zalman's part?

Now this is where I disagree, I ran the same test last night, and 1200 I can live with (just), 1600 bugs me a lot.
Even below 1000 it's audible over the frankly ghastly noise of my PSU fan. The Nexus fans, Stock NZXT case fans and the Noctuas were ALL inaudible at 1000rpm to me.

. If the Scythe fans are 31dB at 1600, and the Silverstones are louder, that seems about right. In truth, come 5 years time, they'll probably be about equal, if not quieter, but given that one of the silverstones has already started making an additional whine, I wouldn't have kept them that long anyway.

 

sammorris,

The FM-121 makes 39.5 dBA at 2400 rpm, and you run it 800 rpm slower, it's a good deal quieter than 31dBA. Buy a steel case and you won't have those noise problems. I certainly don't have them!

Clock On,
theone :>}

 

I wager it's a fair amount more than that!

I dislike arguing like this so I apologise, I've had a stressful week with resit exams and a report, but the fact is, there's no magic bullet with PC case fans, they're all largely similar in the amount of noise they make, separate from vibration issues. Ball bearing fans provide a slightly rougher noise, but as you rightly pointed out, they last longer, and are certainly better at dealing with heat.
I have had Nexus silent case fans for getting on for a year now, and so far no degradation in the noise they put out, likewise with one of the original NZXT case fans, which is sleeve bearing, and has been used constantly for a year, since i gave it to a friend when I got rid of it. Cheap fans do see the end of life too soon after purchase,(look at what happened to my Thermaltake Thunderblade)
but if you make the right decision, sleeve bearing fans last quite a while.

Silentpcreview's numbering system is a little suspect, granted, but with the same types of fan (ignoring those with odd blade types like those of Noctua and Mechatronics) the numbers are pretty consistent so I'm inclined to believe them, and even if you doubt the dB redings they give, the sound recordings are there too, and on comparing those I can tell what's louder and what's quieter. Unfortunately the Silverstones are not on that site (and given it's a site about silent PCs, they probably never will be) but I bet if the Silverstones were on there, they'd be at least 42dB. The Antec Tricool fans were measured at 36dB for 1930rpm on that site, and subjectively they sound rather like the silverstones (although only having 7 blades means they make a much more pleasant, lower frequency noise). If they're 36dB at 1930rpm, then a fan that spins nearly 500rpm faster cannot possibly only make an additional 3dB of noise.
The Freezer 7 Pro cooler, 33-37dB on their site (and that measurement was taken as new at 2400rpm top speed, not 2700 like they seem to like doing) With just one silverstone at full speed, that is utterly inaudible underneath, which must mean they're at least 6dB higher.

I mean no discredit to your hearing Russ, but I like to think I know what I'm talking about in this field, if you suggested at SPCR you could have a near-silent PC using a ball bearing fan with a top speed that high, you'd be laughed at.

To eliminate the vibration factor I removed an FM121 from my case and ran it at the various speeds. At 1600rpm it was obtrusive and easily drowned out all the other components in my PC, at 1200rpm almost all that noise was gone, leaving a hum in the background, but still louder than the rest of the PC, turning it down to 800rpm finally restored silence. I had silence at 1100rpm with the Nexus fans, and no problems as yet.

 

sammorris,

First off, The maximum speed has nothing to do with the noise level I get. We both agree they are loud at maximum speed! I run my 120 at 1400 and the 80 at 1300. I'm not the least bit interested in anything but the sound at those speeds! SPRC can drop on by anytime, and they won't be laughing when they leave! I have to turn everything off in the room including the ceiling fan to be able to hear all the noise the computer makes. The first thing everybody notices and comments on when they first see my computer is how much quieter it is than their's. It's the first thing everyone notices!

Do you realize just how loud 42dBA is? It's about 16dBA above ambient dBA level! That's very loud! I'll have to send you some sound bites, and you will see what I mean. I'll do it late tonight so the ambient noise will be at it's lowest. I only had my hearing checked about 4 months ago and the Audiologist was amazed that I could hear over 21,000 cycles at my age. I have no problem hearing when a tiny ball from a ball bearing from one of my handpiece repairs, hit's the floor, so there's nothing wrong with my hearing!

I'm not the least bit impressed with "SPCR"! I think they are a bunch of fanatics! There testing methods are not the least bit scientific and they seem to favor certain brands, which is very strange given that certain fans that get good marks for low noise never appear on their site. I get the distinct feeling that it all has to do with support! I'll give them a challenge! Find me a 120mm fan that will deliver my present minimum of 72 cfm at 1400 rpm that makes less noise than what I have now and I'll buy it! In other words, put their money where their mouth is! If it doesn't make the same or less noise they can pay for it! One of these days I'm going to haul my console down to Orange and put it in the sound chamber and see exactly how much noise it makes. I don't know whether the results will be valid as there's no ventilation so I can't do it for very long!

Best Regards,
theone :>)

 

Ok, i want a new pc and I'm getting it custom built. I'm an extreme newbie when it comes to pc hardware and etc and thus, not even gonna try to build it. I went to the a computer shop today and the bloke there really helped me out. I really wish I wrote down the stuff he was recommending, so I basically forgot what he said. What I do know is what I want in the pc that i'm getting built.

What I want:

LOTS of hard drive space (I'm talking terrabytes here)
1 GB RAM, maybe even 2 GB
A decent motherboard/cpu/whatnot related to it that's easy to upgrade
A DVD burner
LCD screen
Windows Vista
A video card that'll play some games like Battlefield or WoW

This computer is mainly just gonna be for university stuff, watching stuff, playing games every now and then and storage.

The bloke who I asked today said that all that will cost around $2000 Australian Dollars (roughly $1700 US). So, what would you guys recommend? Thanks in advance!!!

 

popol24..Pretty sure you'll want to buy all your parts from a Distributor within your own country.But U can do a comparison check here
http://www.newegg.com/
Definetly start with a mid to max tower W/lots of internal bays,500 to 1000 watt power supply,a motherbrd W/4 Sata & 2 Ide plugs
CPUs..http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103773
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...50001157+40000343+1050727216&name=Core+2+Quad
Your choice of mobo will depend on your processor choice.
Myself I'm partial to AMD & I went with the 6000+ Dual Core Socket AM2 & Mobo..ASUS Crosshair,even though it has no IDE Plugs
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131593
I got the Enermax Liberty 620 WATT powersupply mainly cause I liked the AMPS +5V=32AMP &2+12V AT 22amps ea
I bought 2 SAMSUNG HDD 500Gig Sata
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152052
Memory at leasr 1024..What ever floats your boat here
I do mostly Video,I'm not a Gamer..So this works out OK for me
Hope this helps a little..Good Luck
I ended spending about $1200.00 US

 

rick5446,

According to the overhead picture on Newegg, there is one IDE right next to the power plug on the MB!



Unless Newegg has the wrong MB displayed, it should be where it is in the picture.

Best Regards,
theone