The Official Graphics Card and PC gaming Thread

This problem Solved, my processor was overclocked 3,2 MHz -> 3,8 MHz. I downclocked my CPU and problem was gone.

Thank you guys!

 

Am I wrong for thinking the CoD games, even the Treyarch ones, deserve more recognition for their single player Campaigns? The MP is long overdone but the SP is always emotional, relevant and timeless. Black Ops, for example, had amazing SP and a heavily emotional and engrossing story only to be forgotten in the wave of MP games. MW2 has a great line, "For those of you with families in Arcadia, it's your lucky day! We're gonna go save their lives!" All during a major Russian invasion. It's not so much fighting for America as it is fighting for a good cause. They strike a chord for me, in remembrance of fallen heroes. I feel that is what the CoD series has always been about.

Captain Price made me feel strong patriotism for a country I am not even a citizen of. The multiplayer was always interesting but I feel the developers deserve more credit for their SP efforts. It takes balls of steel and an eye for detail to craft a GOOD SP campaign. For every player that hates CoD for the multi, there is one that loves it for the campaigns. The best example being MW3, where several studios, including Treyarch, known for their great action but lack of quality, collaborated and were able to pull off a spectacular ending to a previously IW-only series. Not so great multiplayer, amazingly strong and exciting campaign.

Hmm, just guess that I'm remembering the days where the single player campaign was the heart and soul of a game. CoD1 and United Offensive being the main examples. I still play the entire IW-made Call of Duty series. Beautiful scripting and levels, wonderful graphics, even on CoD1. United Offensive is still impressive and would be considered a masterpiece even today.

 

Remember Rich, this is a requisite to get a minimum of 60fps in the title. Games are playable with less.

That's called input lag, and is one of the many reasons I don't use VSync. The next frame is rendered before the first one is displayed - so what you see on the screen is what happened more than a frame ago - this makes aiming more difficult!
In my experience, I have not seen VSync resolve micro-stutter issues with Crossfire. Generally speaking, with an fps above 60, microstutter is very mild I find - but as soon as you drop below 60, it's really noticeable, far moreso than being just below 60fps would normally be.

Jeff: I have enjoyed the COD SP campaigns I've played, and the ones I haven't have excellent reviews - despite the stale, increasingly unrealistic multiplayer, the SP games go some way to redeeming the COD series, just not all the way (in terms of price tag versus campaign length, etc.) imo

 

That is amazing that reversing an overclock solved sjaaksola's problem - good work Sam. And thanks for explaining why vertical sync is a very bad idea for multiplayer - I took pains on the builder post because at first I could not believe my findings.

I rarely quote an entire post, but that deserves to be quoted in its entirety.

Amusingly, I was reflecting on the exact same subject recently as I looked at multiplayer games - notice my huge post 8217 about them maybe 7 posts back - and I was telling myself, that no matter what, the single player was worth the price of admission.

Maybe not for BF3, with a somewhat weak single player campaign (as compared to BF:BC2 with a brilliant single player campaign with the 4 mis-matched buddies creating bad company for each other, lol) and borderline with the Medal of Honor of 2010, finishing up in the snow, which wasn't too bad actually, and the new MOH Warfighter, with a pretty decent single player campaign, but one which was REALLY short. Those two Medal of Honors did not compare to BF:BC2, which was far better, and I would also put Spec Ops: The Line, third person, as a better shooter - one that had a gripping story and which held my attention through 3 consecutive run throughs, ending at hardest difficulty - some very challenging gameplay, especially in dealing with the heavies who were damn hard to kill. By comparison, I can't imagine re-playing MOH Warfighter at the higher difficulty unlocks.

BUT WHEN YOU TALK COD there is no argument, even though MW3 was so short. The gameplay is brilliant and unforgettable - the characters are richly developed and well-acted. I am including ALL the COD series, Infinity Ward and Treyarch titles (excluding COD3 which was not on PC.) The English characters in the Infinity Ward titles were unforgettable, and the Russian guy in the two Treyarch's was equally well-acted.

The other characters were good also, like the bare-chested guy in Black Ops - "You're in Nam baby." That is a Black Ops character I really enjoyed, and the Nam line resonated with me, because every time I click the link to the Vietnam map pack in BC2, I like how the picture suddenly shifts from the soldier with full armor of the Russian map pack, to the soldier shown bare-chested with a loose vest, Black Ops style, the music changing over to that great Creedence Clearwater anti-war anthem "I ain't no senator's son."

So there are 7 COD titles that I think stand the test of time, whose single player campaign is fully worth the investment, even if you never play the multiplayer at all. That means COD1, 2, 4, MW2, MW3, World at War, and Black Ops. Every one of them is a spectacular achievement. Well said Jeff - I couldn't agree more.

Rich

 

I absolutely loved Modern Warfare 1, 2 and 3 and count them among the finest video games I have ever played. Easily a match for the classics CoD 1 and 2. The story and symbolism are second to none, even in the Treyarch games.

This game was a surprise for me and I found it highly involving and thoroughly action-packed. The graphics were a give and take deal with spectacular effects and scenery in some areas and only being average in others. The level design could have also used some work, as it feels like you are being funneled down corridors for a lot of the game. The gameplay, however, is gripping, and the story and setting were extremely original, referencing Apocalypse Now/Heart of Darkness. I really enjoyed it. The creative use of sand, and the story really drew me in. Very very very original game and deserving of more credit than it got. Again, was a HUGE surprise to me, even though it had no common elements with the original Spec Ops series, which was about hardcore military realism. It was originally a PS1 game with a strong focus on Rainbow-Six/Ghost Recon-like realism. Still play Ghost Recon online from time to time. Extreme realism is encouraged to the point where not being able to see your gun was a bragging right. Real enthusiasts knew what the guns looked and performed like. The new Spec Ops title was unexpected and deserved a much larger marketing campaign. The developers behind it are spectacular and are an un-recognized talent.

I also really enjoyed the STALKER series immensely and found "Call of Pripyat" to be a highly enjoyable game, although the structural technology in the first 2 games is well behind the times. They are difficult to get into, but extremely absorbing once the basics are mastered. Believe me, I was a true "hater" for a long time. Only a few weeks later, I found myself debating the basic differences in two very similar ammo types for hours before deciding on a final gun. Even discussed it with a like-minded friend, who agreed on the differences but disagreed on the final outcome. My final product was an Enfield L85A2 fully upgraded with every accuracy and reliability mod known to man, but re-fueled with cheaper ammunition. My backup was a .45 Desert Eagle with rifle type ammunition I got for helping a Military Sergeant in deep trouble. The game offers huge possibilities and allows drastically different play styles every single time. I continue to explore its possibilities. It goes from realistic to ridiculous depending on how you treat the story. Very complicated to get into, but extremely interesting and complex if you understand the basic mechanics. Basically, Russian bullets = far more common at the cost of versatility and accuracy, NATO bullets = more accurate and powerful at the cost of being rare and finicky. Both sides have legitimate reasons for usage and allow both types of play easily. STALKER is a very complex series but presented in an accessible way. It adapts to any play style. Some styles make it a hardcore challenge and some turn it into a corridor crawl. It all depends on you. The depth of the story is unaffected. Needless to say, it has much to do with post-WW2 Russia and their questionable military doctrines.

Also highly enjoyed Mercenaries 2, which featured a realistic conflict, a huge variety of guns, and highly entertaining gameplay. The graphics were average but the actual game mechanics were brilliant. I loved it.

Good examples of forgotten SP games. Don't get me wrong. I enjoy MP greatly and perform decently, but I prefer the single player experience.

 

Yeah, totally in agreement Jeff on Spec Ops: The Line. At first I thought it was dumb, because it starts kind of slowly, and it's super easy in the beginning. But then it starts getting tricky and much more challenging.

In general, like in regard to the Stalker Series, and that new RTS - Wargames: European theater was it? - I think you have a lot more patience than I do, to get into those games, even the ones with absolutely no trainers.

The one exception to that - it appears that you lost patience with Far Cry 2 probably because you didn't discover the boating trick.

I don't blame you - if I hadn't discovered the joys of boating around the map, you are absolutely right - big shoot out every mile when you hit a guardpost - and on the way back it has respawned, and you have another big shootout to deal with. I read about one guy who bought demo charges, killed everybody at the guard post, planted the charges, and on the way back detonated, so he was able to make it easy for himself. I don't exactly remember there being charges - probably because I skipped right over them on the gunshot computer.

I also stopped doing the big antenna assignments, because the guy you had to hunt was way over on the other side of the map, and often the riverways didn't go that far. But as long as I was able to stay 70% of the time on the river, life was a breeze, and the scenery was awesome! You got chased by some other boats, but a sniper rifle dealt with them very fast. My loadout of sniper rifle and light machine gun worked perfectly throughout the entire game.

As a general note about MP:

- what did you think about the shocking discovery that vertical sync hurts multiplayer gaming?

 

Hmmm, another NPB I think.

 

Rich - I already disliked Vsync for its odd impact on game fluidity, but that was the nail in the coffin. It is also known to cause severe performance issues with console ports like Dead Space.

Need for Speed: Most Wanted (2012)
I think 30fps is about all it's realistic to expect from this title for a long time to come.
TEST 1
Certification target: 40fps
SLI Support: No
Crossfire Support: No
AMD HD7900 series not supported at time of testing - retest pending update

1680x1050: Geforce GTX580/660, Radeon HD6970/7870 - 1280MB VRAM required
1920x1080: Geforce GTX660Ti, Radeon HD7870 - 1350MB VRAM required
2560x1600: N/A - 1.5GB VRAM AMD, 1.7GB VRAM nvidia required

Certified CPU: Core i7 3930K
Compliant CPUs: AMD FX-4120/6100/8150, Core i3 2100, i5 760/2300, i7 930/2600


TEST 2
Certification target: 30fps
1680x1050: Geforce GTX470/560Ti/660, Radeon HD5850/6870/7850
1920x1080: Geforce GTX480/570/660, Radeon HD5870/6950/7850
2560x1600: Geforce GTX680 - estimated Radeon HD7970 (untested)
Certified CPUs: AMD FX-4100/6100/8150, Core i3 2100, Core i5 650/760/2300, i7 930/2600
Compliant CPUs: Athlon II X4 620/AMD Phenom II X2 550/X4 920/X6 any, FX any, Core i3 530/i5 650/750/i7 920, Core 2 E8500/Q6850/Q8400/Q9400

 

Well, DDP and Steve were dubious, over on the builder thread, but I certainly don't see myself ever trying Vsync out again - it's hard enough to survive for long against some of these sharpshooters, as it is, without a setting working against you lol.

Rich

 

Vsync is fine for a lot of games and I use it frequently, but it's really down to the hardware being used and the game being played. Most games do not play well with it, but titles with very high FPS usually don't mind it.

 

Just got through a very long and tedious process of building a new machine for a LAN this weekend.

Original planned specs were as follows:
CPU: (new) Core i5 3470
RAM: (new) 2x4GB Corsair XMS PC3-12800C9
M/B: (new) Gigabyte H61MA-D3V
GPU: (new) MSI Radeon HD7770
PSU: 2008 Antec EarthWatts 380W
Case: 2006 NZXT Lexa
SSD: 2010 Intel X25-V 40GB
HDD: (undecided)

When the system was assembled, there was no POST despite reseating everything - ignoring the unlikely event of a faulty CPU, when I established that the GPU worked fine in an old system, it was either going to be the board or the RAM - being easier to take apart and into the shop I brought the RAM back first, but there was no issue with it. On returning the board I found out that although the board "supports" Ivy Bridge CPUs on the spec sheet, you can't even POST the system without the BIOS being updated (I later learned this is an Ivy Bridge limitation, not specific to any brand). The board comes with the oldest BIOS on by default, but get this, a BIOS so old, that you can't run the BIOS update utility on it as it's too out of date. So unless you get Gigabyte to personally send you a board with a more recent BIOS pre-flashed or have an old Sandy Bridge CPU to hand, you don't stand a chance, ergo the board does not support Ivy Bridge CPUs as far as I'm concerned.

Being an Asus exclusive partner, this was the highest end Gigabyte board I could get my hands on - they offered me an Asus P8Z77-LX in its place, which I begrudgingly accepted, given I was short on time. Upon installing that, the system did POST and install windows, but in exact time to the activity on the HDD (an SSD only at this stage, no mechanicals), you got a horrendous screeching from the PSU in time/tune to whatever disk I/O was going on - same noise as coil whine, only very loud (50-60dB+).
Additionally if one of the six SATA ports was used in particular, the system would simply power off as soon as the disk was read to load windows - not crashed or rebooted, powered off. Clearly there was some short fault in the ICH. When returned, no fault was found (surprise surprise) but I was given a lecture by the store staff about running an HD7770 with a 380W PSU, below the recommended spec.

Ultimately, I conceded to buying a 500W Corsair CX V2, which was the best inexpensive PSU they had on offer, and I went to the shop next door (yes, Tottenham Court Road is like that!) and bought the sole high-end Gigabyte board they had, a Z77MX-D3H. Have just installed that, and so far so good.

My luck with Asus does not seem to be improving, does it?

 

Have run much higher end/more power hungry cards than a 7770 on an Antec Earthwatts 380 for extended periods of time. 9800GTX+ OC, 4890 being the two that come to mind. So it seems somewhat fishy for the PSU to be a problem unless bogged down with HDDs.

BTW, I thought you already had a fairly capable LAN PC??? Is this going to be a new machine or is it a replacement/update to an existing unit? Many of the parts I recognize from previous machines. Obviously wasn't an expensive project... If a replacement, what's being replaced?

What influenced the choice to go Ivy Bridge? Aren't there still plenty of SB CPUs floating around or was it specifically intended to stay stock and take advantage of Ivy Bridge's small improvements?

Just curious, more details plz...

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Just for the record, am not finding myself in need of any new hardware, but lining it all up anyway. Due to several pending business deals, I will be finding myself with a surplus of brand-new hardware due to swapping.

Next purchases/acquisitions will be:

- 1090T/1100T new or used, any price, this is happening for sure, either used from a friend, or I will be paying a stupid price for one

- Newer Gigabyte motherboard if used 1090T can be secured. Has a fairly high end board included, purchased last month.

- Possibly looking at 6970 from a friend, with intent to find a second for Crossfire, while enjoying slightly higher FPS overall and removing memory limitations. Bit miffed as 7000 series remains stupid expensive, but 6000 series is OOP/EOL. So finding a second card might be a chore.

- New PSU. 2008 Seasonic-built 620HX is still pulling strong, bless its soul, but reporting lower voltages than it had for several years. Not a good sign. Time for a replacement.

- 1 or 2 new HDDs to replace my old-timers.

- New Cooler, preferably a known quantity better than the Cool-It Eco. Considering Thermaltake Frio after several hours of research and reading reviews. The Cool-It simply does not agree with this environment.

- Several changes to airflow to accommodate using air cooling again. Have been running without a side panel for a month or so now and enjoying lower temps, so a side intake modification for the video cards is in the works.

^Could use some feedback on this guys^

What's frustrating is that my current video cards have plenty of processing power for any game, but are limited by their memory. Simply having 2GB each would eliminate my need to upgrade them. As it is, there are already a few games I would like to play but have avoided simply due to memory limits. Currently I stand to gain more from the extra memory of a 6970 than I stand to lose from the slight decrease in overall power. Also eliminates Crossfire scaling issues which the HD6800 series was plagued with. Should be a tidy upgrade over all when CPU/Video/Mobo upgrades are combined. Not to mention my chances at a better OC by far.

 

There are obvious gains in running the 1090t over the 965 Black. If you can acquire one, I'd say $250 is well spent. Much more than that though, and the seller is taking advantage...

I don't regret my purchase

 

Well there are plenty of them available. Amazon has several 1090s and 1100s listed from different sellers. If buying new it would be obvious to choose Intel, but as it currently stands I can get within the ballpark of Intel while retaining most of my current hardware.

Am willing to pay up to $300 for one but hoping I wont have to pay a dime if all goes well. Sneaky business practices but not questionable enough to illicit guilt

My 955BE will simply not hold an OC properly anymore, so something needs to change there. Hoping to address everything all at once with PSU/Mobo/CPU being replaced. 955BE going off to a good home and staying stock.

 

Jeff:
The machine is being built to serve as a lightweight LAN PC - prior to the rackmount rebuild I used to take my server in a travel case when making the 400 mile round trip to York for our LANs, but now it's in a 4U case and weighs significantly more, that's no longer remotely realistic.
The main games PC is simlarly immobile due to its size, so a new PC build was in order, as of the other two machines, the E5200 is now at work, and the E4300 is a bit long in the tooth for the job given that the P31 board only supports a max of 2GB of RAM!
I was on the fence about Ivy Bridge, take it or leave it, but the fact that it's the same price as Sandy Bridge meant I saw no reason not to buy the more recent CPU, that plus stock of the IB CPUs is a little more prevalent in high street stores, which is where all the new parts for this build have come from. The lack of decent boards available from such stores is the reason for the mayhem in the first place.

If you want a side intake, have it lower down - unless you run a heavy OC or your CPU cooler is weak (as I understand it, neither apply to you), your GPU/chipset area needs more cooling than higher up the case. Place a large fan (minimum 120mm) centred so that the hub is around the same height as the gap between the two graphics cards, or perhaps higher if the chipset suffers heat issues a lot.

 

Call of Duty: Black Ops 2
SLI Support: No
Crossfire Support: Yes (55%)

GTX680: 1920x1200 Certified, 2560x1600 Compliant
GTX670: 1680x1050 Certified, 1920x1200 Compliant
GTX660Ti: 1600x900 Certified, 1920x1200 Compliant
GTX660: 1600x900 Certified, 1920x1080 Compliant
GTX650Ti: 1366x768 Certified, 1440x900 Compliant
GTX650: 1024x600 Certified, 1024x768 Compliant

HD7970GE: 1920x1080 Certified, 2560x1440 Compliant
HD7970: 1600x900 Certified, 1920x1200 Compliant
HD7950: 1600x900 Certified, 1920x1080 Compliant
HD7870: 1440x900 Certified, 1600x900 Compliant
HD7850: 1366x768 Certified, 1440x900 Compliant
HD7770: 1024x600 Certified, 1024x768 Compliant
HD7750: 800x600 Certified, 1024x600 Compliant

Certified CPUs:
AMD Athlon II X4 (any), Phenom II (any X4 or X6)
Intel Core i-series (any), Core 2 Duo E8500, Core 2 Quad Q6850/8400
Compliant CPUs: Athlon64 X2 5200+, Pentium E5200/Core 2 Duo E6700

 

Oh dear...

CRYSIS 3 ALPHA - HIGH:

SLI Support: 52%
Crossfire Support: No

GTX690: 1920x1200 Certified, 2560x1600 Compliant
GTX680: 1600x900 Certified, 1920x1200 Compliant
GTX670: 1440x900 Certified, 1680x1050 Compliant
GTX660Ti: 1440x900 Certified, 1680x1050 Compliant
GTX660: 1366x768 Certified, 1600x900 Compliant
GTX650Ti: 1024x600 Certified, 1366x768 Compliant
GTX650: 800x600 Certified, 1024x600 Compliant

HD7970GE: 1680x1050 Certified, 1920x1440 Compliant
HD7970: 1600x900 Certified, 1920x1200 Compliant
HD7950: 1440x900 Certified, 1920x1080 Compliant
HD7870: 1366x768 Certified, 1600x900 Compliant
HD7850: 1280x720 Certified, 1440x900 Compliant
HD7770: 1024x600 Certified, 1280x720 Compliant
HD7750: 800x600 Certified, 1024x600 Compliant

CRYSIS 3 ALPHA - VERY HIGH:

SLI Support: 90%
Crossfire Support: No

GTX690: 1280x720 Certified, 1440x900 Compliant
GTX680: 800x600 Certified, 1024x600 Compliant
GTX670: 853x480 Certified, 1024x600 Compliant
GTX660Ti: 853x480 Certified, 1024x600 Compliant
GTX660: 640x480 Certified, 800x600 Compliant
GTX650Ti: 512x384 Certified, 640x480 Compliant
GTX650: 320x240 Certified, 512x384 Compliant

HD7970GE: 1024x600 Certified, 1024x768 Compliant
HD7970: 800x600 Certified, 1024x600 Compliant
HD7950: 853x480 Certified, 1024x600 Compliant
HD7870: 853x480 Certified, 800x600 Compliant
HD7850: 640x480 Certified, 800x600 Compliant
HD7770: 512x384 Certified, 640x480 Compliant
HD7750: 320x240 Certified, 512x384 Compliant

Video memory requirements:
HIGH: 1.5GB @ 1680x1050/1920x1080, 2GB @ 2560x1600
VHI: 2GB @ 1680x1050/1920x1080, 2GB @ 2560x1600 (nvidia), 3GB @ 2560x1600 (AMD)


Certified CPUs:
AMD: (None)
Intel: Core i5 750/2500K+, Core i7 920/2600+, Core 2 Quad QX9770

Compliant CPUs:
AMD: FX-8150/8300, FX-6130/6300, Phenom II X4 975BE
Intel: Core i5 750/2500K, i7 920/2600+, Core 2 Q6700/8400

 

The fan is placed exactly where it needs to be, over the video cards and overlapping the lower chipset cooler, 140mm ;P

 

reminds me of the first Crysis all over again, the nostalgia is bringing tears to my eye's.

 

I'm not sure that's the sort of nostalgia I want