The Official PC building thread -3rd Edition

Yeah having separate platforms for every range of CPUs is a little contrived. I can under stand server grade vs consumer grade. But wasn't the i7 pretty much released touting its gaming capabilities and the fact that the exclusive X58 chipset supports SLI AND Crossfire? That puts it as consumer grade in my eyes. Super expensive, but consumer grade nonetheless.

*sigh* I'm gonna miss the Athlon 64 really bad. So many years and so many good memories

 

I think the i7 was initially designed as a server grade technology, but when Intel saw what ridiculous levels of performance it could offer the gaming and multimedia markets, it was rebranded into what it is now.
The Athlon 64 X2 is what formed the backbone of what transformed my interpretation of PCs as tools into what it is today. The P3 system I first owned, Hawk, amazed me at first, it was a cutting edge system for its time and cost a substantial amount. It was very long in the tooth when it was finally replaced by Eagle in January 2004, however, and for the last year of its use, it was an irritance to work with.
Once I moved to the Athlon XP, my taste for getting the best began to grow, and with limited finances I went about that completely the wrong way. Eagle II, the upgraded basic system which saw the Radeon 9200, stock case with a single 80mm fan and an inWin 250W PSU replaced with an X800 Pro, Superflower case and a Qtec 450W PSU was a disaster, and during the summer before I left for university, it was to be replaced with a system designed to be high performance from the outset, enter RMS-Alexandra, v1.0.
A PC I had designed from the ground up, aesthetics to my taste, amazing performance, and I knew the system inside out as I designed it. No curiosity over strange OEM parts. This was no off the shelf machine, this was like a child. This is exactly how my relationship with PCs has been ever since, and it was this system that caused that. Sentimental yes, ludicrous I suppose, I'd get all sorts of strange looks from people if I went around telling people, yet I bet deep down a few people who post here can relate to what I'm talking about.
The relevance of this to the discussion is that the Athlon 64 (or more specifically, the X2) being my main work CPU was short lived. When the A8N-SLI SE in this PC began to fail after 5 months, the 'experimental' machine I was building to play with overclocking a Core 2, had to become my main system, cue RMS-Alexandra v2.0, complete with, I shudder, a P5N-E SLI which I chose over a GA-965P-DS3 for familiarity reasons with Asus hardware. The X2, and a new board, an A8R-MVP, went into my new file server, RMS-Darkstar, and played second fiddle to the Core 2 until its eventual sale to Greensman after the demise of the A8R-MVP in 2008.

 

I know exactly what you mean with every word. A machine doesn't have to be high-budget or flashy to be of sentimental value. It's all about the effort you've put into making that machine the very best it can be. You take great care in choosing components and that shows through when every build turns out more awesome than the last. They are, in a sense, your babies. Something you've built yourself and have gotten much enjoyment out of.

Did I sum it up pretty well? That's my sentiment with the Athlon 64. I've spent most of my geek career using the Athlon 64 and they have a special place in my heart

 

Estuansis,
It's compatible only if it is Am2/AM3. Strictly AM3 CPUs are not compatible because they lack the DDR2 Controller and absolutely will not work in AM2 or AM2+ motherboards. The only AM3 only chip that I know of at the moment is the last released Phenom II. I'm waiting for the AM2/AM3 Phenom II at the moment! That will give me two platforms to use it on!

Russ

 

AFAIK it's the other way around. The AM3 chips have the DDR2 memory controller to use AM2+ boards. But AM2+ chips don't have the memory controller for DDR3 which keeps them from using AM3 boards.

I'm sure there was an article on this somewhere:

http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=9739&Itemid=1

Best I could find at short notice.

Though I could be completely wrong. I'm still using AM2+ remember

 

Sam,
Take heart! Had I not had the experience of building Gina's P5N-E SLI, I would have built one for myself and been in the same boat as many other people who bought that POS were! It was the first motherboard that ever made me talk to myself and question my own abilities! LOL!!

Russ

 

Same experience with my M2N32-SLI Deluxe. Couldn't OC more than maybe 400MHz and even had stability problems at stock. I was glad to sell it off.

 

Estuansis,
Actually there are 5 AM3 only chips at the moment. All are Phenom II based and have no DDR2 Memory controller. These will not run in AM2 or AM2+ motherboards. Future AM3 chips will be AM2/AM3 CPUs. It's the main reason I waited on getting a Phenom II. The current Phenom II 955 will only work in an AM3 motherboard! I'm 100% certain as I checked with AMD about it when the 955 came out. It's AM3 only, for now! The AM2/AM3 version is supposed to be out within the next month, at the latest!

Russ

 

sam & Estuansis,

I feel the same way for the most part. Time and effort you dedicate to each build makes it something more special then just any other device and starts to a take on a life of it's own (in a figurative sense).

The reason I started designing my own is somewhat similar to sams. Had enough of the crap you get when buying a pre-built one and figured that if I pick the parts right I can get more for my money. And as a side benefit it's a heck of a lot of fun lol.

Anyway to keep this one topic, if it really is possible to use phenom II's with a AM2 or AM2+ I might throw together one of those systems this summer depending on how cheap I make it.

EDIT: based off Russ's post (above) going to need to wait for the 'new' AM3 cores to come out.

 

I'm glad I jumped on my Phenom II 940. It's completely an AM2+ chip and doesn't support DDR3 AFAIK though I'm not sure. If the only thiing AM3 has going for it is DDR3, I'm not impressed. Higher latencies are poison to AMD chips.

 

Estuansis,
You are correct. Your Phenom II is DDR2 only. In spite of the latencies, DDR3 is still faster because of it's higher bandwidth!

Russ

 

I think the higher bandwidth will cancel out the latencies and you'll get something of nearly identical speed. Either way, for now at least, I'm still quite partial to my DDR2

 

The way I see it, the memory performance of DDR3 is the same as DDR2, but costs more for it. Where 800mhz would be CAS4 or CAS5, 1600mhz is typically CAS8 (mega expensive) or CAS9. The higher speeds will of course mean higher bandwidth, but more performance? Hmm...

Re:AM3/AM2+, I thought the 955 was AM2+, and that the 800 series was AM3... Confusing isn't it?

 

Soo...do you think that DDR3 is still TOO cutting edge. Too early to trust it I guess???

 

Not too cutting edge. It works great for i7. But I don't think it's the right technology to match up with AMD chips. They like lower latency while Intel chips like higher speed.

 

That was my understanding of AMDs as of the late original AM2 chips like the 5600+. Not sure how things have progressed in that regard, as until recently, AMDs haven't even been worth considering.

 

I think it's still the same way seeing as AMD chips still use an integrated memory controller.

 

see i dont have that feeling for my PCs, to me its a tool, that i can build and use.

 

Probably because you only keep them for six weeks before selling or breaking them...

 

Right. I've put a lot of time, effort, and money into building my PCs. They are meticulously maintained and assembled to a professional level of excellence. I take great care just routing my wires let alone picking which components to use just so my wire-management is decent If anyone broke any of my PCs I would cry

EDIT: Well, maybe not literally. But I would be very very upset