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The Official PC building thread -3rd Edition

Discussion in 'Building a new PC' started by ddp, Jul 16, 2008.

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  1. omegaman7

    omegaman7 Senior member

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    I really appreciate what you've done creaky. And on my own level, I have comprehended and been informed in my own way. LOL!

    I'm trying to understand the complex nature of each device. Router, Switch, Access Point, Modem. I guess I understand what a modem does. And if I had to guess the exact nature of a router, from what I've been reading, it's essential to security over the Lan/Wan. It's been referred to as a Traffic cop on multiple sites ;) And yet it also does the same thing as a switch/Access point. So I'm still at a loss for why someone would need a dedicated access point, or switch, when a/or multiple routers will do the same job...
     
  2. creaky

    creaky Moderator Staff Member

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    Modem - self explanatory, doesn't do any routing, think of the old fashioned diallup modems, they make a racket (ah, memories!) then connect to wherever, but that's all

    Switch - I can't remember the exact terminology but suffice it to say a device plugged into a port on a 100mbit switch has the full 100mbit on that port, and the data is intelligently sent where it needs to go, whereas ~

    Hubs - transmit that data to all ports or something. Hubs are pretty much irrelevant these days hence why my knowledge is rusty. I have an old Netgear 4 port hub somewhere that sometimes used to get used on Unix servers as there are times when a Hub can save the day, sorry can't think of a relevant example off the top of my head, haven't used a hub in a very long time.

    Obviously if you have hardly any devices you can run everything off the 4 switch ports that most modern routers provide. I have more than 4 devices so i use as many switches as required. Cat5/5E Ethernet (which is all i use as i don't bother with gigabit at home) has quite a long workable distance, something like 300 feet or so, but of course extra switches can provide convenience.

    There's managed switches where you can configure VLANS and whatnot, i am not a networking freak nor does my area of Unix cover much networking over and above what is required to build and administer Enterprise level servers (as you usually have dedicated network engineers, or there's system engineers who do a bit of everything. and various other people/roles but you get the point, at work there's Copper ethernet, Fibre Channel etc etc, but again i'm a bit rusty on all that good stuff, i've configured failover & fault tolerant connections, some servers have quad ethernet cards or multiples of quad cards, etc etc; these things are server-side hence why i know how to do these things, whereas there's some network configuration on the network side that someone else would take care of).

    But anyways, there's also unmanaged switches where you don't have to configure anything, they're 'dumb' to a degree. The most you have to do on these is flick them into uplink mode as some switches have a fit if some switches aren't in uplink mode ie they clash.

    Router - routes traffic, usually incorporates a 4 port switch. Modem Router usually incorporates a 4 port switch and obviously a Modem, plus does Routing.

    'Gaming Adapters' - basically a dumbed down/stripped down router, basically a ripoff.

    Access Point - basically a dumbed down/stripped down router i think, i don't bother with them, i just use standard routers and configure them as necessary. For instance, i just checked my main router and it has the following modes - AP, Client, Client Bridge, Adhoc, Repeater, Repeater Bridge.

    There's loads more to it all but that's the easiest way i can describe everything. Got to go eat dinner but i'll come back and edit the definition of switches and hubs properly :), i'm sure Sam (for instance) can probably verbalise hubs and switches better than me, instead of me googling them, i always have trouble describing the two things. I've probably generalised above re Routers, there's NAT etc but i don't trouble myself with every detail on all subjects, i'm a great believer in knowing (more than) enough to be knowledgable but some things i just filter out if i don't need to know them, i research such things as and when i need to. Can only fit so much in the old brain you see, i tend to run out of RAM :)
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2010
  3. omegaman7

    omegaman7 Senior member

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    Dinner eh! lol! Eating breakfast here :p

    Thanks creaky :D
     
  4. creaky

    creaky Moderator Staff Member

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    I think that describes it all well enough (i've no doubt over explained some things as that's my way). Anyone feel free to correct anything i posted, i regurgitated virtually all that off the top of my head.
     
  5. omegaman7

    omegaman7 Senior member

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    Well...think what you want. I just bought the gigabyte wireless card, the wireless buffalo router, and a HEC HTPC case. Will have friday :D The case is gonna house an older MSI board, for my brothers living room media center :) and open up MY tower for my current gigabyte board. And my future gigabyte board(GA-790FXTA-UD5) will be going in my wonderful HAF 932 CM case.
     
  6. creaky

    creaky Moderator Staff Member

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    Your money, but they're both only capable of WPA security. WPA/TKIP's days are numbered... you should really have bought something that supports WPA2/AES. Ah well, can't say i didn't tell you so :)

    From Newegg's meagre list of routers i'd have picked this ~ Linksys WRT54GL
    As to a PCI card i've have picked the Linksys WMP54G which i know is totally linux friendly, can't remember if it works under WIn7 though. Pricy from Newegg though. But at least that and the Linksys router support WPA2...
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2010
  7. omegaman7

    omegaman7 Senior member

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    Security. You're referring to people hacking into her stuff, correct? Hackers are generally only interested in things that are of interest to them! In over 2 years, her computer has seen 1 virus. She doesn't do a whole lot of google-ing, or visiting of untrustworthy sites. The only thing to really worry about would be someone hijacking here connection. In this town...pretty unlikely. So I think it will suffice for now. Am I mistaken? Im open to your input :)
     
  8. creaky

    creaky Moderator Staff Member

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    The trouble with wifi is that there's too many people out there with sticky fingers, idiots who like to hack into neighbours' networks just because they can see them via a simple network scan. She was obviously more secure before on a wired connection, now she'll be visible from outside in the street.
    If someone gets onto her connection they could be downloading or visiting places they shouldn't be and your mum would get the blame.
    If you can't change them it's done now but if it was me i would only buy WPA2 capable stuff. People get taken to court often, even if it's blatantly obviously they wouldn't download certain things or visit unsavoury places, you only have to look in AD's news articles to see examples of that..
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2010
  9. omegaman7

    omegaman7 Senior member

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    The population in this town is around 1,000. Maybe 2,000. Most of them are friendly people. Though we do live right next to the main highway through town...

    I'd say the odds of her being hacked, or internet stolen are extremely minimal. Of course now that i've said that... LOL!
     
  10. omegaman7

    omegaman7 Senior member

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    You've taught me much today creaky. Somehow I overlooked the encryption protocols, but in the future, i'll know now. Perhaps I'll even return the other.
     
  11. sammorris

    sammorris Senior member

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    From what I understand:
    Hub: Everything gets sent to everything. If the target machine receives data not meant for it, it gets binned.
    Switch: Data only gets sent to the machine that it's due for. This allows for much better bandwidth throughput.
     
  12. creaky

    creaky Moderator Staff Member

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    Off topic - Am settling down for a night of news articles, people such as this make my blood boil, it's no wonder i can never sleep and it's no wonder i can't find work. Crooks such as this sit there and brazenly refuse to say where $2 trillion of taxpayers money has gone. We have the Bank of England who i believe are exactly the same as your Federal Reserve, ie private central banks above government reach. I don't always find enough detail on the UK side of things, it's easier to research the US goings on. I need to go calm down and make a coffee!, sorry but this stuff makes me see red. This is part of the reason i live on the internet, researching the crooks. Until people like Ron Paul get to audit the Fed, and people over here start waking up to all the bank looting what chance have i and other got, of getting off the net and in keeping with the thread title, 'PC building'. How long has it been since many people have spec'd up machines to build, a blumming long time.

    SEC Engages in Conspiracy with AIG to Hide Bailout Evidence


    On topic - Just looking out for you OM7 :)

    edit- what Sam said :)
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2010
  13. omegaman7

    omegaman7 Senior member

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    Creaky. Is there not some way to tell the router, to only except certain IP's? Basically, it would only allow specified devices to connect to the router. Or is that simply not supported with the router I bought. I think i'm asking if Port Forwarding will help me here. But i'm not 100% confident on what port forwarding is yet. Perhaps a little LOL! Or am I simply really screwed with the router I purchased. Go ahead and tell me I *beeped* up. LOL!
     
  14. Red_Maw

    Red_Maw Regular member

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    You can use MAC address filter to augment the WPA security and that should keep most wannabe hackers out.

    I can get at least 2.5MB/s steady from my wireless router and an average of 6MB/s across my own network iirc. Can't recall if I've ever streamed a full 1080p video though.

    It might have changed but when I was looking for a wireless router a few years ago not all routers had all the configurations you listed. My router can't act as an AP or Bridge which is how I ended up buying an AP (cheaper and easier to setup lol). I would agree though, if you can get a router that does all that there's not point in getting an AP.
     
  15. sammorris

    sammorris Senior member

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    It's not really about the throughput rate, it's about the stability of that throughput.
     
  16. Red_Maw

    Red_Maw Regular member

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    I know what you're saying sam but in it's defense I have to say that while it might not be 24/7 stable like a wired connection it's never dropped once to any noticeable effect (at least to a point where I could clearly blame it on my wireless connection). I don't have a lot of large files so I can't say I've seen throughput that high for any longer then ~1 hour. To be honest I wouldn't use wireless in less I had to as wired is so much faster, more reliable and simpler.
     
  17. sammorris

    sammorris Senior member

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    Ah, I'm not suggesting it drops out entirely, but the data throughput of wireless is very inconsistent, it may not affect your throughput rate much, or your web browsing ability, but it makes streaming high-definition content (which requires a continuous stream of data at good bandwidth) difficult unless the signal is absolutely perfect.
     
  18. Red_Maw

    Red_Maw Regular member

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    Yeah I understood what you meant, I don't think a totally dropped connection wouldn't be noticeable lol. From perspective though when I'm d/ling stuff I've seen it above 2MB/s for at least an hour (d/l would have failed otherwise or a would have taken longer to complete).

    Do you think this bloated 1080p rip I have would be a good test (I'm curious to see if I can steam "full 1080p" perfectly mysefl lol).

    BITRATE.......: Variable ~ 12279 Kbps
    AUDIO.........: English DTS 5.1 @ 1536 Kbps
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2010
  19. sammorris

    sammorris Senior member

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    For what it's worth, the vast majority of download clients take an average download speed, sampled either over the entirity of the download, or over a period of maybe 10 seconds plus.
    A 1.75MB/s 1080p is a good example to test with. I would be surprised if it streams perfectly from start to finish, but it's not a technical impossibility, just very unlikely.
     
  20. Red_Maw

    Red_Maw Regular member

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    Yes you are correct. If I have time to watch a decent portion of the movie (I have neither the will nor time to watch all of it) this weekend I'll post how "perfect" it was.
     
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