The Official PC building thread - 4th Edition

Not enough memory means everything falls back on the performance of the hard disk. If you have a slow drive, it's a twofold performance decrease. Run out of RAM with a raptor and things get very tedious. Run out of RAM with a slow drive and you literally get to the stage where opening a program allows you to have a quick coffee break.
1GB on win7 isn't as bad as many cases, as it will run a few things, just not games. 1GB on Vista on the other hand, is appalling, no worse than 256MB on XP really. Both lead to 10+ minute boot times, 25+ if you install a lot of programs.

 

Sounds about right

 

You guys should see the single core/Vista eMachines that WalMart used to sell with 256MB of ram in them! They actually bragged on the label about how fast it would run your Apps with 256MB! Gives a whole new meaning to slow! LOL!! I've upgraded a lot of them from 256MB 533 memory to 2x1GB of 800MHz ram. I've also replaced a lot of hard drives because the computer literally wore them out using the drive for virtual memory. Maybe that's why eMachines don't have a Hard drive light. It would be on all the time!

 

I may have seen a 512MB vista PC but I've never seen the likes of a 256MB one. Quite frankly, I'm amazed they booted. 256MB is below the minimum system requirements for Vista and I believe in order to get volume licenses of Windows you need to be putting them on compatible machines. That model will likely have been withdrawn shortly after it was released.

 

I would never sell a pc with that low of ram. I'd give them my Ram if it came to it. That's nothing short of disgusting!

I almost gave my 2gb to my buddies computer. I changed my mind

 

lol WOW truly disgusting. I've certainly given people RAM before ;P

 

I would have gave him my 2gb from my secondary, and used his 1Gb for my secondary. But i'm uncertain about it's ram modules. I did recommend to him getting better/more Ram. He is a rather casual user. He doesn't even have the internet. I think he's just using it for playing vid files, and playing with FL studio. FL studio loads kind of slow, I believe due to shortage of Ram. It nearly saturated while loading. He did get a good deal though, as bad as it sounds. 120$ for a used rebuilt computer consisting of:
250Gb HDD (good shape, Smart checks out nicely)
3800 x 2 Athlon 30 - 40$
Near new motherboard 80$
Plus the value of the tower itself, and all my time I put in I probably could have sold it for more, but he is my friend

It has a bestec PSU. :S

 

It's not too bad with the default plugins, but if you add any VSTs, FL Studio likes RAM. I mean, I've had it up to 1300MB and beyond with high-end VST plugins, just for FL studio alone.

 

Crap. I'm really gonna have to strongly recommend more ram then. Thanks sam.

 

Sam,
This was a couple of years ago, and I was stunned reading the peel off label on the front of the computer (why do people leave them on?). It was a "W" series, that WalMart was selling with Keyboard, Mouse and 17" Widescreen LCD monitor, for $299. They had both Intel and AMD models. They were only sold through WalMart, and eMachines does not directly support them or even list the model. Warranty was through WalMart!

Oxi was the top of the "W" series line of single core AMDs (3800+). Externally, it looks like any other eMachine, but the case and 250GB WD drive is all that remains of the original. it currently has a GigaByte MA785GM-US2H motherboard, AMD 630 2.8GHz Quad core, Freezer 64 Pro, 4GB 1066 Ram, Thermaltake 500w PSU, Optiarc 7220 ODD and an XFX 4670/1GB GDDR5 Graphics card. It's amazing how much you can improve an eMachine by throwing out all the garbage that came with the original, and replacing them with quality parts! ROFLMAO!!

Russ

 

Indeed. I've heard PC shops say that the emachine boards are garbage. It's the number one reason for an emachine being down i've heard. Though they probably use different boards, just like everyone else. Perhaps that was simply at that time. Perhaps they had nvidia chipsets :S

 

Amazing how much more expensive the machine becomes too

I think they were just low quality boards, they could have been nforces, but just generally the quality of emachines hardware is usually pants, they use appalling PSUs, and that's generally reason enough.

 

OMAN7,
Only the Intel models had real crappy motherboards. They were made by Asus and Winfast, with Via chipsets and Intel graphics. The AMDs were made by Foxconn with nVidia 430 chipset and nVidia 6100 graphics, and could handle up to 95w CPUs. When I called eMachines to confirm that I could use the Athlon IIx2 6750, they told me that, and since the machine was never registered by the original owner, registered it to me, and gave me a 1 year extension on the Warranty! It lasted 4 years total! It finally failed after running the 630 Quad for about 6 months. I pulled it's Foxconn replacement to replace it with the GigaByte, but the Foxconn board is good, so I'm giving it to a young friend and his wife, who are kind of down on their luck at the moment! They have a Case, memory, CPU and PSU, but their motherboard went south!

Best Regards,
Russ

 

Woohoo Catalyst 11.2 was my magical fix! Finally cleared up about 99% of my inconsistent scaling issues. Also fixed a lot of Crossfire non-related performance issues I didn't have before my HD6850s. The 5850s used to be much more consistent game-to-game but now they are roughly equivalent with the 6850s holding a slight edge. Took ya long enough ATi, but I'm a happy gamer once again

 

Man did I get a surprise this morning. I've been helping Rick (Blackman) get some of the right parts ordered so he can build himself a decent running computer in a decent case. He was thinking about an AMD phenom II Quad core, so I suggested the 955 BE, because it was on sale for $159. Then I saw that the x6 1090T BE was on sale for $40 more, so he says OK I'll get one of each, and I said that That's the CPU I want, so he says, OK, I'll get two, One for you and one for me. I just thought he was kidding around, although he hasn't been feeling real well lately and somewhat disoriented, but I said, look, don't order the 955 because I'll send you mine, along with a new Freezer 64 to cool it with. He doesn't overclock, so no problem there, and he says fine!

The next day I called him because he can't get the sound to work right with either WLM or Yahoo messenger, and he'd asked me about some other items, and I mentioned that I would be sending him the package as soon as I installed the 1090T, and he asked me what the heck I was talking about, and I mentioned our conversation from the day before. The first thing he asked is did we talk yesterday, so I chalked it up to this disorientation, and Joked with him a bit about being disappointed, because he didn't remember anything, but I understand! Then I just forgot about it.

This morning, Russell comes home from work, and knocks on my door. I was half awake and he asks me if I ordered anything from Newegg, because there was a package for me from them. It was the 1090T! So I called him and was stumbling for words, and he started to laugh, and says that I need to get the 1090T installed and get that 955 and the cooler shipped out to him. Then he says, thank you to me for all my help! If that don't beat all I don't know what does!

It's installed and running at 3.9GHz. It runs at 4.0GHz stable and 4.1 semi stable. more than likely I could tweak some of the adjustments and get it completely stable, but I don't want to run it at that high a voltage. You have to take the voltage to 4.25v for it to run stable, so I decided to back it off to 3.9GHz and play with the ACC a bit in Hybrid mode to improve the performance. Got it running at 82,000+ MIPS, with a memory bandwidth of 7300+. It passes stress testing, IBT and doesn't crash running DVD ReBuilder! I'm a bit disappointed in ReBuilder because it only saves me about 5-6 minutes over the 955, but it runs so cool. It never got over 33C with Rebuilder/CCE, and didn't get close to 40C stress testing. Worst was 36-37C. I'm at 1.392-1.408v depending on load, and the HyperTransport is running at 4800MHz. It runs smooth with no surprises, and I've yet to see it actually slow down! There's also noticeably less heat coming out of the exhaust through the CoolIt, than with the 955. The only thing I screwed up on was the bios. I thought that I had read the it needed the F9 bios, but it needed the F10c. I had to put the 955 back in it and flash the bios, and then everything worked fine with the 1090T. About 20 minutes of extra work, but not so bad. Live and learn! It sure is sweet though!

I also finished up the motherboard install on Oxi, and it screams now. That GigaByte MA785GM-US2H is one great motherboard. Russell told me that there is no slowdown like there occasionally was with the nVidia Chipped Foxconn board, and he shows a full 3.25GB of ram like mine does instead of 2.75GB with the 6100 graphics that you can't shut completely off like you can with the HD4000 graphics of the new motherboard. now everything is full action all the time! With the HD4670/1GB GDDR5 in it, it games real well for him! He went at it with AOE II and 7 army's and he is smiling a lot! LOL!! 43,000 MIPS and a memory bandwidth of just under 7000. Not too bad for a $90 stock 2.8 quad Core.

Russ

 

Way to go on the hex core Russ! I will only be using one if I can work out a deal like that. Got my 955BE 2 weeks old for some cash and a case of beer LOL. The guy bought it, OC'd it some, and promptly bumped up to a 1090T. One day he's wondering if I want it, next day he's at my door telling me "$80 and a case of beer and she's yours." LOL how could I pass it up? That's STILL cheaper than buying new XD

I will personally attest to the quality and features of Gigabyte's mid-range AMD boards. You would be hard pressed to point out a functional difference between my old MA78G-DS3HP and my MA790X-UD4P. Was really impressed when the guy I sold it[the 780G] to immediately threw a 955BE in and started OCing!

He used one of my favorite techniques, adding RAM sinks from a video card cooler onto the VRMs. See the weak point for the mid range boards is the lack of VRM cooling. This is what limits them on wattage and when OCing quads. Simply with better cooling, the boards can be made to take 125W CPUs problem-free. With this quick and easy modification, that board has been running the OC'd 955 @ 3.7Ghz for almost a year cool and stable. For the $75 I paid more than a year ago, that is one kickass budget board. It hasn't shown a single sign of being overly strained or stressed, and he even occasionally lends his rig to my folding score. Now that's quality!

 

Well if there's ever a valid reason to own a Phenom II X6, then I suppose that's one of them! Congrats

Catalyst 11.2's tempting, but the rampant reports of screencorner lag are putting me off. I can fix the corrupted cursor at the desktop by opening and closing windows magnifier and beyond that I don't have any bugs with 10.12a.

 

Estuansis,
The thing that's great about the MA785GM-US2H is that it can handle the 125w chips. The thing I like the most is if you have to send a video card back for RMA, you still have HD4000 Graphics to fall back on, with no penalty in memory when it's turned off. You can really build a better than just decent low cost Quad core by putting a propus in one of them. Russell's is impressive at stock speed. Stuff really moves fast in AOE II and AOE III. Lots of things happening on screen, and with the 4670 with 1GB of GDDR3, it is an impressive card for the low bucks it cost! There's only a single ATX 12v plug from the Thermaltake 500w PSU, but since it's not overclocked, there's no problem. I'm going to get a Y for it though. They don't cost very much I replaced the weak 92mm fan with one of my Silverstones that are a 92mm fan on an 80mm frame, and it moves some serious air without a lot of noise. With a good fan, the eMachine T and W series cases coool very well! I was worried about the motherboard fitting, but eMachines though ahead and the stand-offs are built in the the motherboard tray. It fit real easy. That motherboard has more than enough adjustments too! It's features are impressive too! 5 Internal Sata, 1 e-Sata, 6 rear USB, D-Sub, DVI, HDMI, 7.1 dolby Surround, Firewire, Optical S/PDIF. Very hard to beat for the $69 it cost! It's GigaBytes best selling motherboard, and a legend in the making! Newegg alone has verified sales of over 1100 of them. It's closest competition at 662 verified sales, is the ASUS M4A79XTD EVO AM3 AMD 790X, and it costs about $30 more! A mini ATX with 4 memory slots is a bonus too! They are $79 right now, but they go on sale often for $69 and occasionally for $59. It's like finding money!

Best Regards,
Russ

 

Sam,

It is impressive. Very smooth in operation too. What get's me the most is how easy it was to overclock. I had it running for a couple of hours at 3.8GHz, and all I had to do to go beyond that was raise the CPU NB VID to 1.250V, NB to 1.300v and the CPU voltage to 1.4v. It will also run at 4.0GHz with the same settings. To get to 4.1GHz, I need to up the CPU voltage to 1.425v. It should easily do that at 1.4v with a GIGABYTE GA-790XTA-UD4 AM3 board as the AM3s overclock a bit better than the AM2+ Boards do. The thing I find hardest to understand is the lack of heat with all 6 cores stressed at 100%. There's a 5C lower difference in temps of 37C max vs 43C max for the 955 BE in the same motherboard when encoding video, and it doesn't come close to hitting 50C with all 6 cores at 100% CPU Usage running Prime 95. You can feel the difference with your hand in the exhaust coming out of the Coolit Rad! Under those conditions it only hits 47C. Since they are both 125w CPUs, I have no idea how they do that!

With Oxi and the new motherboard, Russell says it runs sweet! I lucked out with the XFX 4670/1GB SDDR3 (not GDDR5). It's the perfect match for the MA785GM-US3H motherboard. Everything looks good, and so far no lag anywhere! Again, it's just incredibly smooth, and it's running stock at 2.8gHz! You git two Happy campers now! LOL!!

Best Regards,
Russ

 

I figured I might as well post this on the Build thread as wellas the AMD Build thread! Here's the benchmarks for my new 6 core. I'm a pretty happy camper!

Processor Arithnetic



Memory Bandwidth



Multi-Media



CPUz



I'm pretty happy with the results of my overclock! I had it to 4.1GHz, but I had to bring the CPU voltage up to 1.425v, and I don't want to go over maximum voltage. It will run stable at 4.0GHz at the same 1.392v, but 3.9GHz is fine by me. I want to leave a little room as always.

Best Regards,
Russ