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What Would you Do

Discussion in 'CD-R(W) Media' started by rodrigo_p, Oct 19, 2003.

  1. rodrigo_p

    rodrigo_p Member

    Sep 29, 2003
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    What Would you Do

    Hi ,
    First Sorry About my English
    2° Sorry again, to make again some question that you maybe already have been posted (But I really try to search another similar on the forum and doesn´t be)

    I have a problem with my audio´s cds , because they doesn´t lisen as well as they used to.
    I was sure the problem was caused by the burner LG 8x4x32x , two years ago.
    All the things turned me to that conclusion
    Nobody knows nothing about my problem here in Mexico.
    I only had information about the cds that maybe was wrong because the humidity ---here rains a lot especially now--
    And all the other stuff implicated on this: the humidity , the places you keep it , the mark, and the fungus that appear ,because you touch it on the brilliant face of the disk .

    But all of them was a joke to me , because I thought a cds will be play good for a very long time without a problem

    And that´s the reason why , I thought that about the Burner, without a reaason why,
    Although nobody tell me an explication
    **(well, once a technical of LG told me about an error ocurred on the units that doesnt burn to the appropiated tempearature and that´s one reason why my burner do that. But when I call again to explain me more, they denied and told that the unit was good, and the only way to know is it was alright , was making a cds and if it sound fine the unit will be o.k. -- I told her I can do that . The last one stupid thing that him told me, was that my computer was wrong and I have to change it.)**

    But afterall I was sure the problem was the Burner.

    But once on a forum here en Mexico a sew about the problems with the cds caused by de humidity , because they dont put it all the elements to make a really save disk on Country With a lot of hot like Belice , Panamá, Costa Rica, Guatemala, includind the Caribean Calleding this Marks : Sony , Verbatim , Kodak and others .But unfortunatelly, I only used Sony , because I thought they were good and won´t have any problem in the future. But never give problems, until now.

    But seeing this, I start dont to trust on them and again restart thinking about maybe de problem was the cds.

    --I start reading yours post , all about the material are they made like Cyanine or Phthalocyanine
    --Taiyo Yuden made the Fujifilm , one of the best , but no more
    --The Best CDs are made on Japan
    --Some Good Marks Maxell, Ricoh, Mitsui (Well , in the post I read , someones says yes, but others doesn´t)

    O.K. Thats a really, really great information

    But now I have a Big Problem, A lot of cds sounds like crap, and I need to start save all I can.But they are a lot and require time and money.

    To make this posible I Bought a New CD-Recorder an AOpen 52x24x52x , If in case the problem was caused by my first Burner.
    Great isn´t , but Again I have a really stupid lucky, I can only burn at 8x without problems , because my AMD is old at 533MHZ , I could change it , but again I will need money . I can only Put it more Ram .Maybe Late , after fix all of this.

    All My Cds are Sony , From the Begining to Now .
    I start Burning the "12 May 01", just only 2 Years. That´s the Date of my First CD I heard Yesterday and the last 5 songs start to sounds bad , just like the others with "hiss" , well the last 2 songs sounds really bad.

    In Some cds the "noise" start in the middle and are making higher to the end.
    In Others are in All from the Begining to End or Viceverse but not to strong like the fist ones
    And the last ones , random someones yes and others not
    In Some others the "noise" is to high, that the song cant´t even lisen , but in other are low .
    But This are increase by the time, and I need to hurry up, to make Backups.

    I dont know if the cds are wrongs , but maybe
    I have don´t lisening to all of them , but all that I can

    I Bought it in Diferent Places and Time
    I Star with Sony 74Min CDQ-74CN (XO Excellent Optical Technology) 8x All of this now sound bad (Really All)
    Made in U.S.A.

    Sony 74Min CDQ-74CN (XO Excellent Optical Technology) 12x Good
    Made in Taiwan, R.O.C.

    Sony 74Min (SUPREMAS) 16x Good
    Made in Taiwan

    Sony 74Min (SUPREMAS) 24x I heard all of them, and really sounds wrong.
    Made in Taiwan This was the first that I heard the problem.

    Sony 74Min (SUPREMAS) 32x Sounds fine, but almost all have noise at the end
    Made in Taiwan

    Sony 74Min
    (I really dont know, because my brother gift me with a " tower", but it doesnt a paper or description) Sounds fine all

    ---Then I Bought like 150 of --- -Because here doesnt more sell Sony with 74min only 80min

    Kodak (ULTIMA) 8x This Sounds fine
    Made in Mexico

    From Kodak to the Now I´m sure will be fine all , because they only have like one Year of been created

    Sony 80min (SUPREMAS) 32x (They change the covers of the Cd with a picture of a man an a woman)
    Made in Taiwan

    Sony 80 Min (SUPREMAS) High Speed 40x
    Made in Taiwan

    --And Finally after I Know About my poroblem , I was thinking thinking to make my backups with this, I I bought a Couple of Boxes to Prove.

    Verbatim (Super Azo) High Speed 48x
    Made in Mexico

    That´s all finally , I REsume Maybe like 200 cds Sounds Wrong and the others starts to be like them.But the cd at 24x that ones are the most wrong , you can even hear or sometimes doesn´t can´t be reading by some Stereos

    And I have Some Questions, About . I hope you Could help , I Will be really , really grateful any suggest are welcome.

    How many years will be o.k. an original cd?
    (what´s the diferences between an original and a Burn cd, I know the Equipment, but what else. why it are better)

    How Many Years .....................a burn cd (a good one)?

    Which are the best marks of cds (CD-R disc makers) ?
    (I know all of you make a lot of test, and sometimes change the results between you and the other people here, but someone that you know , although it doesn´t the best , but someone that well be o.k. for several years , I have been looking some of yours post and I think someone that you posts a lot is Fuji, but Not now , because TY are not more , but maybe still being good and I´m satisfied , maybe is not he best , but if work.
    Unfortunatelly I think here in Mexico doesn´t sells Fuji , I Found TDK, Ricoh,Sony,Samsung,LG,Verbatim ,Kodak(not more), the selfsmarks on Office Depot, and others, but until now I never look to them . "But wherever you write, I will try to find it"
    Of Course I want Quality , but I prefer the time which it keeps save , and I think a good Cd have this 2 characteristics.

    If I get unbranded Cd´s , but it are made By TY, still been good, than the other other ones with a recognize Brand?

    The life of a cds will be longer, if it is of data?
    (I have been thinking , to make it on mp3. I will make 2 Copies . One for Lisening and the other backup
    Because If I start to make a single cd copy of audio of every cds , it will be a lot of money and time, and to image that this problem pass me again , I will be so mad, because I´m doing this to be secure that this time will be the best I can. In that way I can Keep it like 12 records on one, and if is true that on data keeps for longer time , thats will be great)

    Is better to burn at 4x?
    Someones tell me to burn at 4x because is the way to keeps a good quality (I burned at 8x all my cds with my Lg, thats was the max speed and sounds fine and now with the AOpen still sounds fine , I have to Burn at he same speed that Lg , because to my AMD is old.
    I see that are special cds audio , but are expensive
    But it doesnt affect the life of the cds. If you burn it to a high speed will be have less time of life?

    How is the best way to keep it for longer time?
    Of course clean , dry , in its boxes and all the stuff , but the speciall thinks like , dont put it under the ray of sun or light. You should keep it on a Close Box without light or something like this

    Does Any one have or had this problem sometime?
    (Here in Mexico I Posted on a lot of places and talking with people and nothing, but on Boards of English posted a cuople of this .This Problem sometimes happen when you burn with more speed thant the cds supports or when you have made a certain number of copies on your burner like 1500 or more. But thats all.
    --- The last one I saw was a link on a Forum with the Comment on this page , which says , that after 2 years or less the cds doesn´t can be reading . And thats the same Problem I have.

    I´m really really hurt . I was so angry , because without mentionated the money and time , In which way how can I get back all the stuff I had --I will never Could find all of it-- , how many time I spent on that and making numbers it´s a lot of money drop , plus the time I will have to take to fix this and again the money.

    Last edited: Oct 19, 2003
  2. Praetor

    Praetor Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 4, 2003
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    1. Branded verses unbranded cds dont matter much. Its the underlying manufacturer that counts (i.e., TY)

    2. Officially CDs last like 10 years but effectivly only like 3-6 depending on wear and tear of course. Humidity, sunlight and such dont help.

    3. Temperatures do matter when burning but not a whole lot unless the ambient temperature is like 40°C+ all the time or of the computers temperature (and specifically the burner's) is consistently 60°C+
  3. tigre

    tigre Moderator Staff Member

    Feb 18, 2003
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    Hi rodrigo_p.

    English is not my native language too and I have to read a lot the whole day - so I skipped a big part of your post. Sorry If I've missed something important.

    Some (hopefully useful) thoughts:

    CD-R(W) media dying after a few years is quite common. It has happened to me and others I know.

    What you can do about it:

    1. Try to restore data

    1.1. For audio CD-Rs use Exact Audio Copy in secure mode. It will take a long time to extract dying CDs but results will be better then with anything else. Trying different drives and comparing results is a good idea as error recovery abilities are very different between drives. After extraction EAC gives you the possibility to listen to suspicious positions and to correct them manually if needed.

    1.2. For data CD-Rs youse CDDataRescue or CDCheck. - Trying different drives is a good idea here too.

    2. How to reduce these problems in future

    2.1. Use decent media, e.g. TY

    2.2. Create additional backups

    2.2.1. Backup for audio: If your source is CD, use some lossless compression like monkey's audio or flac, otherwise the lossy compressed files (e.g. mp3) you created your CDs from. Fill (at least a part of) the saved space with PAR2 error recovery files using QuickPar (available at sourceforge.net). Save the audio files and the PAR2 files to your backup media (either CD-R or HDD - not much more expensive than CD-R media)

    2.3. Store it at a cold, dark, dry place.

    2.4. Don't use too high burning speed.

    Another nice idea - if your focus is on audio CD-Rs anyway: Create mixed mode cds in future (= audio track + data track). Fill free space on the CD with PAR2 error recovery files created from the original .wav files that are source for creating the audio part of the CD. It's important to use correct offsets for writing (and reading if recovery is needed)._X_X_X_X_X_[small]AFTERDAWN FORUM RULES: http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/2487[/small]
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2003

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